oké,
so we've had the odd weirdo-newcommer at our sessions,
we've had the odd one-man-show at our session,
but nevertheless, each of our sessions still goes well.
most musos are par with each-other, but not all.
so, what do we do?
suggestion: apart from our regular sessions (1 each week, each in an other venue), we'ld like to start a real 'tune-learning-session".
aim: to encourage newcommers into learning new repertoire (read: played repertoire at our regulars) and to vary the repertoire with new tunes (speed at our sessions is mostly too high for 'students' to catch tunes 'on-the-fly')
Hello, I'm a complete newcomer to this board, but I have run tune-learning sessions for some friends who were musicians but new to folk music, so this is quite a convenient topic for me to start on...
We usually meet in someone's house, have a few glasses of wine and learn a few tunes from the usual session's repertoire slowly, bar by bar but without the dots, additionally going over tunes from previous weeks at a medium pace. I think it works - they've certainly joined in with a lot more tunes. I put the dots up on the web for people to consult if they forget them as well. I've also found it a useful way to sneak in new tunes which I'm too scared to start in the session itself in case nobody joins in!
I think as well as being useful for session purposes it's quite a nice social event as well - it's referred to as 'Tunes and Wine'.
No. It's a great idea if you have the time and room to set it up. I've been asked at sessions to play a tune through a few times until someone picked it up, and I used to teach a piper friend of mine some tunes in my kitchen when I still lived in Belfast; I don't feel guilty about not having the time now, though.
hey helb, welcome to the board!
you sound like me!
i'll be honest: we used to have a "flutes-only-closed-thursdaynight-tune-learning-session-at geert's-place".
but this all wasn't session-related.
we worked in somewhat the same way (learning a tune, refreshing the earlier tunes, spread dots for who needs and mp3's on the net for other needs, ...)
who are you? where are you from?
what instrument do you play?
(put something in your profile, while you're at it)
"I've been asked at sessions to play a tune through a few times until someone picked it up, and I used to teach a piper friend of mine some tunes in my kitchen when I still lived in Belfast. . ."
i've done some one-on-one tune learning in the past, but my question is rather: how do you think about doing this as a 'group-effort'?
those of you who work this way (i thing of zina and her gang): do you do this with session-playing in mind?
did it grow out of a session, or was the tune-learning first?
do other musos (not attending the tune-learning-session) appreciate this?
do they encourage it, or do they object to the fact that you learn (sometimes) tunes 'outside' the regular repertoire?
and if they do object, how do you solve this?
just some questions, feel free to (not) answer ...
On the subject of tune learning sessions, it's certainly a great idea and one which would be appreciated by players at up-tempo sessions who are averse to slowing down, as well as by beginners who feel intimidated by the afoermentioned sessions.
Brendan Mulkere teaches a class in London; the students then have a session afterwards which is at beginner level to begin with and which gradually becomes more advanced as the night goes on. Everyone's happy.
" ... the students then have a session afterwards which is at beginners level to begin with ... "
must work, no?
but does the session " ... gradually become more advanced as the night goes on ... "
due to arrival of more experienced players? meaning:
- session starst of as tune-learning (say at 6-ish),
- then beginners level with the studenst (thus "closed-session", arround 8-ish)
- and finnaly more advanced 'real' session (by 10 or so)?
Yeah something like that. Some of the advanced players go to the class to learn new tunes and refine thie rtechnique; they may or may not join in the session from the very start. However, they usually take control around 10, by which time other musicians hav begun to arrive who don't go to the class. The beginners are in a geat situation since they get a session at their level and aren't afraid to stay on and join the "big" session later. They also know many of the advanced players well, which makes the whole thing more welcoming.
Sorry MM, I just realised I misread your post to me I think tune-learning sessions are a great idea, and have been in ones in most of the forms listed here i.e. house sessions, pub sessions, formal classes, whatever, wherever. I like the sound of Helb's Tunes & Wine too. Just as long as you let people know what they're in for if you have a "learning" session prior to a "normal" session. As people have said many times, there are lots of different ways into this music; use whatever works. But sometimes going to the same session week after week works too
what happens to the backers (guitars, bodhrans, ...) at these sessions? do they join? do they learn the tunes too? or are they 'not tolerated'?
don't the guitar(s) also need to be taught 'new' tunes, in order to blend in with the others? or do you leave them to work alone?
Good point Maarten. To be honest, there aren't that many backers at this particular session as far as I remember. I don't remember there being a bodhrán player except for me and I rarely play it these days. I think there's a guitar player who turns up late on but that's about it.
problem at our reg-sessions: often flooded with backers.
(you know, something new's in town: ah, music! i play guitar, and it's folk, i have a folk guitar! aha: irish: bodhran, just find me some stick ...)
but i must be honest: there's a couple of good whackers and backers arround ... and we miss them if they're not there ...
guess i'll get them mp3's ... ?
In the past I have hosted what I called "Celtic music workshops" and invited some of the most talented and knowledgeable musicians to be guest teachers. Each teacher did a one time afternoon "slow session", where any questions and discussions were encouraged. Usually the workshops were held on four consecutive Saturdays in the Spring (Mar-April). These session workshops were well attended by all types of musos, and since I recorded them. the tapes were made available to be circulated to whomever was interested.
I am always interested in learning or teaching new (OLD) material . There is so much to learn and teaching is a good method for improving my own skills. I even encourage beginners to try teaching what they know, to anyone who will listen. When the attitude is positive the benefits to both are great.
MTC's .
WB
We have what we call a "Slow Session" starting at 7 at someone's house. From there it's just 2 minutes walk to our regular session which starts at 9. Our group has quite a few beginners (me being one of them).
The purpose of the slow session is to get the beginners up to speed with the repertoire, and to help them with any questions they may have about sessions, ITM or whatever. Recently it has also been used for expanding the repertoire of the more experienced players.
I have been recording our regular sessions for several months now, and I must admit, I cringe when listening to some of the tunes I've joined in on, so I'm only going to be doing that with tunes I know really well. The slow session, however, allows me to try tunes I know I will screw up.
What I get out of it as a beginner is social interaction with ITM-minded people, technique, history, vast resources of knowledge and experience that I can tap into (there is always at least one experienced member there), getting to know our session's variations of the tunes, and most importantly, endless patients from the experienced sessioneers.
What they get out of it? I'm not sure. I think they're probably just very nice people.
I've been thinking along similar lines myself, and the idea of having a slow learning session before a main session is a great Idea.
If your based in the Manchester area and are interested in attending such a session let me know and I will organise one in a room separate from the public bit of the Pub above the Monday night Beer House session from say, 7:30 to 8:30, and then downstairs for the main session.
I've been a big advocate of a learning session, or "slow session" as they're sometimes referred to, at our local pub for a long time -- and finally one got started on the second to the last Tuesday of the month. The only thing I wish there were more of though, (and I'm guilty of this myself,) is to have more experienced players helping out. I once witnessed a Comhaltas session in Ennis where Sonny Murray and a couple of other fellas were leading the tunes and providing a great example at a learning session. The difference there being that most of the participants were under 15. Here in the SF Bay Area they're nearly all of legal drinking age.
A word of caution about tune-learning or slow sessions: it would be best for the main session to be a separate event, on a different night or at least in a different pub.
If you have a slow session right before the regular paced session, the regular session may soon be overrun by the slow session. Actually, it is at the point where the slow sessioners turn into medium sessioners. But you quickly lose the focus of the regular session.
The caveat being that the slow session will be popular and attract a bunch of people to it so as to out-number the regulars in the main session.
once-a-month tune-learning session, followed by slow-session (getting used to making up sets 'on the fly', recognising tunes as they are played, ...).
this all in the light of the weekly sessions elsewhere.
i do understand your point, jode, about the session being overrun by the slow/medium session and losing the interest of the regular players.
(i actually hope some of the regulars might be interested in joining the 'tune-learning' bit for the tunes' sake)
Jill Elliot of Bristol runs tune-learning sessions for fiddle twice-weekly for players of all standards from beginners to advanced. See her website http://www.jillefiddledd.com/ for further details.
Trevor
MM...good luck and let us know how it goes! It sounds like it could be very successful. And keeping some session regulars involved will make it more communal.
Several folks around here (Santa Fe, NM) have hosted slow sessions, tune learning sessions, etc. They seem to be short-lived ( several months running) but they have certainly been useful to me and I attend as often as possible. I guess mostly I wanted to say, don't discouraged if yours turn out also to be short-lived - it doesn't mean they weren't extremely useful.
The same kind of thing (beginners and experienced and how to mix) always comes up in folk dance groups, too, and all the discussions on this site about etiquette, what kind of group, how to integrate new folks, etc, etc, etc, would be the same if "folk dance" was substituted for "ITM", so it seems to be the human condition, and therefore extreme variability seems to be the norm!
But a tune learning session is a good idea, and whoever attends will be really grateful. So keep up the great work.
A very interesting thread - I think the slow session is definitely the way to go. There are interesting aspects though such as "how do you keep a slow session slow?" Experience shows that as people learn tunes they always want to play them at normal speed. The Wednesday Culturlann session in Monkstown started slow but as the years went by and a couple of hundred tunes were learnt it soon became a normal speed session. To cater for newer musicians a dedicated slow session was started on Tuesdays but again as time went on the pace increased. A solution has now been found where every 4 months or so a number of sets of newer tunes are introduced and these are kept at a slower speed irrespective of the competencies of musicians present. This means that for the first hour and a half the session is slow/medium. After that tunes are played at whatever speed musicians prefer. The approach seems to work quite well as the final part of the night allows people to play tunes tunes they'd learnt during earlier slow sessions at the normal speed.
i guess you're trying to warn about the same thing as jode:
or the regular session would loose intrest from experienced player (jode)
or the slow would evolve into a regular one.
i guess keeping both seperate and making the aims clear should help avoid these things.
anyway, if the slowsession turns into a regular one, this would mean that the goal is reached: the musicians involved in the slow-session are upto playing at regular level!
and if no new interest comes, why not? and if new blood knocks on the door, we just start all over again, yes?
I'll come out of the woodwork for a post...
Some of us in Longmont, Colorado have been going to our same tune-learning session for more than three years, now. It's a great way to learn and teach. Everybody who comes ends up teaching a tune eventually, and we all learn more tunes. Then the added benefit: Several of us go to other sessions, and we have a few more tunes in common since we learn them together. Sometimes we bring our kids, too. Starting three years ago, as a beginning piper, this tune-learning session has been a great way for me to eventually get to the point where I can now play more tunes at speed, and learn more tunes more quickly, by ear.
Interesting to see this thread on the very night I started my own such session. Just returned, and I'm very pleased with the results. The pub owner was jazzed about having music in his pub - his cronies are now hopped up about having their kids come in to learn - and the regular punters were extremely receptive and appreciative, despite the jaunty nature inherent of a 'learning' session.
As for the actual musicians - I set it up specifically because there's a group of them in my area who just need an opportunity to sit down and play with others at a more relaxed pace than what the regular sessions offer. Everyone enjoyed the exchange of information and opportunity to join in on the action. Gave me a chance to play the pipes a bit too!
I remember attending such a regular session in my 2nd year of playing the fiddle - though it was not formally billed as such, it was conducted in such a manner that I was able to play what I was working on without feeling intimidated, and it got me a) used to playing along with (and *listening* to) others, and b) comfortable playing in front of an audience. It takes more time to get used to doing those things if all you have available is a faster session. It gave me more motivation to practice and prepare each week, that's for certain.
For backers, I am trying to make sure that I have somebody experienced on hand to help get the chords sorted out - quite educational actually for everyone in attendance.
Secretly, I really set it up because it's the closest irish pub to where I live and I'm sick of driving all over Hell's half acre to play. I'm hoping to organically grow my own local session.
I've been going to a local slow session for 2 years now...the first time I went I'd been playing flute for all of about 3-4 months, but I had played whistle off and on for the prior decade. It allowed me to learn from a more experienced flute player who hosts the session just how to play the dang thing, and I've greatly increased the number of tunes I know (I'm now quite comfortably at the "I don't know this reel's name but it goes like this" stage).
One suggestion - once a month is a long time for a newer session player to go between sessions. How about twice per month? I'd say two shorter sessions per month are much more helpful than one per month. Also, grab a tape recorder or use the mic and a CD on your computer and play through the most frequently played tunes at your regular session - play through them once at a painfully slow speed then up to session speed. Our slow session has 4 tapes like this, and they're invaluable...it gives the players something to practice with inbetween sessions.
eric,
i think once-a-month is about all we can manage for now.
most of us still do have a professional and/or family life!
i have both, but almost all my spare time goes into music (of any kind) so, for me it wouldn't really be a problem (wife and kids might object though).
i am going to 'direct' these sessions, hopefully together with at least one other muso, but it will be located elsewhere (see 'paul's kitchen' under the session section).
about the mic/C'ter thing: i made some mp3-recordings of top-session-tunes to distribute by email, but i suggest to every new soul to bring some kind of recording device for this purpose. i'm not going to hold their hands, the biggest effort has to come from them!
when everything else fails, they can always turn to 'one of us' to play the tune for them to tape, if need be, at the regular session.
mm
We're pretty lucky here. The local Hibernians let us use their hall hold two slow sessions monthly where we teach new tunes the 1st hour and polish ones we've already learned the 2nd. We also have our regular montly session where we start with a even pace the first hour and encourage our slow session players to join in. Of course, after that 1st hour, it's full speed ahead.
We're very fortunate to have some excellent players here who are patient and love to teach tunes. Other things we are doing is as mentioned above, recording and distributing MP3's of commons session tunes and encouraging the new players to bring recorders to all sessions.
tune-learning sessions?
tune-learning sessions?
oké,
so we've had the odd weirdo-newcommer at our sessions,
we've had the odd one-man-show at our session,
but nevertheless, each of our sessions still goes well.
most musos are par with each-other, but not all.
so, what do we do?
suggestion: apart from our regular sessions (1 each week, each in an other venue), we'ld like to start a real 'tune-learning-session".
aim: to encourage newcommers into learning new repertoire (read: played repertoire at our regulars) and to vary the repertoire with new tunes (speed at our sessions is mostly too high for 'students' to catch tunes 'on-the-fly')
what do you guys/girls think of the idea?
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Hello, I'm a complete newcomer to this board, but I have run tune-learning sessions for some friends who were musicians but new to folk music, so this is quite a convenient topic for me to start on...
We usually meet in someone's house, have a few glasses of wine and learn a few tunes from the usual session's repertoire slowly, bar by bar but without the dots, additionally going over tunes from previous weeks at a medium pace. I think it works - they've certainly joined in with a lot more tunes. I put the dots up on the web for people to consult if they forget them as well. I've also found it a useful way to sneak in new tunes which I'm too scared to start in the session itself in case nobody joins in!
I think as well as being useful for session purposes it's quite a nice social event as well - it's referred to as 'Tunes and Wine'.
Helb
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by helb
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Doesn't every traditional player, in any genre, simply consider it part of their responsibility to the tradition to do something like this?
KFG
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by KFG
Re: tune-learning sessions?
No. It's a great idea if you have the time and room to set it up. I've been asked at sessions to play a tune through a few times until someone picked it up, and I used to teach a piper friend of mine some tunes in my kitchen when I still lived in Belfast; I don't feel guilty about not having the time now, though.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: tune-learning sessions?
hey helb, welcome to the board!
you sound like me!
i'll be honest: we used to have a "flutes-only-closed-thursdaynight-tune-learning-session-at geert's-place".
but this all wasn't session-related.
we worked in somewhat the same way (learning a tune, refreshing the earlier tunes, spread dots for who needs and mp3's on the net for other needs, ...)
who are you? where are you from?
what instrument do you play?
(put something in your profile, while you're at it)
mm
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Hi MM, I'll stick something in my profile immediately [didn't know about those...!] but in short I'm a fiddle player and I live in York, England.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by helb
Re: tune-learning sessions?
"I've been asked at sessions to play a tune through a few times until someone picked it up, and I used to teach a piper friend of mine some tunes in my kitchen when I still lived in Belfast. . ."
In other words, you've done something like this.
KFG
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by KFG
Re: tune-learning sessions?
(what's your point, KFG?)
i've done some one-on-one tune learning in the past, but my question is rather: how do you think about doing this as a 'group-effort'?
those of you who work this way (i thing of zina and her gang): do you do this with session-playing in mind?
did it grow out of a session, or was the tune-learning first?
do other musos (not attending the tune-learning-session) appreciate this?
do they encourage it, or do they object to the fact that you learn (sometimes) tunes 'outside' the regular repertoire?
and if they do object, how do you solve this?
just some questions, feel free to (not) answer ...
mm
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Yes!!! hehe but I didn't consider it my responsibility, and wouldn't criticise someone for not having done something like this.
Actually I forgot to mention, I taught the bodhrán for about 18 years as well.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: tune-learning sessions?
That'll be about 25,000 Hail Marys Conán
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Just a person
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Don't worry Orson, I'm wearing the hairy shirt and chains under my suit as penance. Matt Talbot wouldn't come close.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: tune-learning sessions?
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Just a person
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Conán in a suit AND a hairy shirt? You'll cause even more swooning here than you have already once the yanks wake up
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Just a person
Re: tune-learning sessions?
I got my mojo working
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: tune-learning sessions?
so, orson, any thought on the subject?
mm
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
I think we need pictures of Conán, with suit, shirt and mojo! We might need a volunteer to check if it really was working though
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Just a person
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Only fans of hirsute, baldy men need apply.
On the subject of tune learning sessions, it's certainly a great idea and one which would be appreciated by players at up-tempo sessions who are averse to slowing down, as well as by beginners who feel intimidated by the afoermentioned sessions.
Brendan Mulkere teaches a class in London; the students then have a session afterwards which is at beginner level to begin with and which gradually becomes more advanced as the night goes on. Everyone's happy.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: tune-learning sessions?
sounds like the way i'ld like it to go, conán.
" ... the students then have a session afterwards which is at beginners level to begin with ... "
must work, no?
but does the session " ... gradually become more advanced as the night goes on ... "
due to arrival of more experienced players? meaning:
- session starst of as tune-learning (say at 6-ish),
- then beginners level with the studenst (thus "closed-session", arround 8-ish)
- and finnaly more advanced 'real' session (by 10 or so)?
mm
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
"I taught the bodhrán for about 18 years as well"
Was that a particularly slow pupil then Conan? Or does it always take that long to learn it?
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by showaddydadito
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Yeah something like that. Some of the advanced players go to the class to learn new tunes and refine thie rtechnique; they may or may not join in the session from the very start. However, they usually take control around 10, by which time other musicians hav begun to arrive who don't go to the class. The beginners are in a geat situation since they get a session at their level and aren't afraid to stay on and join the "big" session later. They also know many of the advanced players well, which makes the whole thing more welcoming.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: tune-learning sessions?
No Dave, it took me that long to learn how to teach it properly!
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: tune-learning sessions?
PS I was 9 yrs old when I started teaching
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: tune-learning sessions?
sounds really like a great way to work.
i hope eventually we'll come to a session like that.
thanks conán for the inspiration ...
mm
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Sorry MM, I just realised I misread your post to me
I think tune-learning sessions are a great idea, and have been in ones in most of the forms listed here i.e. house sessions, pub sessions, formal classes, whatever, wherever. I like the sound of Helb's Tunes & Wine too. Just as long as you let people know what they're in for if you have a "learning" session prior to a "normal" session. As people have said many times, there are lots of different ways into this music; use whatever works. But sometimes going to the same session week after week works too 
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Just a person
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Geen probleem, Maarten!
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: tune-learning sessions?
oh, and sorry, i need to ask:
what happens to the backers (guitars, bodhrans, ...) at these sessions? do they join? do they learn the tunes too? or are they 'not tolerated'?
don't the guitar(s) also need to be taught 'new' tunes, in order to blend in with the others? or do you leave them to work alone?
mm
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Good point Maarten. To be honest, there aren't that many backers at this particular session as far as I remember. I don't remember there being a bodhrán player except for me and I rarely play it these days. I think there's a guitar player who turns up late on but that's about it.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: tune-learning sessions?
you surprise me, conán ...
problem at our reg-sessions: often flooded with backers.
(you know, something new's in town: ah, music! i play guitar, and it's folk, i have a folk guitar! aha: irish: bodhran, just find me some stick ...)
but i must be honest: there's a couple of good whackers and backers arround ... and we miss them if they're not there ...
guess i'll get them mp3's ... ?
mm
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
In the past I have hosted what I called "Celtic music workshops" and invited some of the most talented and knowledgeable musicians to be guest teachers. Each teacher did a one time afternoon "slow session", where any questions and discussions were encouraged. Usually the workshops were held on four consecutive Saturdays in the Spring (Mar-April). These session workshops were well attended by all types of musos, and since I recorded them. the tapes were made available to be circulated to whomever was interested.
I am always interested in learning or teaching new (OLD) material . There is so much to learn and teaching is a good method for improving my own skills. I even encourage beginners to try teaching what they know, to anyone who will listen. When the attitude is positive the benefits to both are great.
MTC's .
WB
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by wvwhistler
Re: tune-learning sessions?
We have what we call a "Slow Session" starting at 7 at someone's house. From there it's just 2 minutes walk to our regular session which starts at 9. Our group has quite a few beginners (me being one of them).
The purpose of the slow session is to get the beginners up to speed with the repertoire, and to help them with any questions they may have about sessions, ITM or whatever. Recently it has also been used for expanding the repertoire of the more experienced players.
I have been recording our regular sessions for several months now, and I must admit, I cringe when listening to some of the tunes I've joined in on, so I'm only going to be doing that with tunes I know really well. The slow session, however, allows me to try tunes I know I will screw up.
What I get out of it as a beginner is social interaction with ITM-minded people, technique, history, vast resources of knowledge and experience that I can tap into (there is always at least one experienced member there), getting to know our session's variations of the tunes, and most importantly, endless patients from the experienced sessioneers.
What they get out of it? I'm not sure. I think they're probably just very nice people.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Shrog
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Sorry, forgot to mention: our slow session includes fiddle, mandolin, guitar, whistle and flute. That's pretty extensive.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Shrog
Re: tune-learning sessions?
I've been thinking along similar lines myself, and the idea of having a slow learning session before a main session is a great Idea.
If your based in the Manchester area and are interested in attending such a session let me know and I will organise one in a room separate from the public bit of the Pub above the Monday night Beer House session from say, 7:30 to 8:30, and then downstairs for the main session.
PP
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Pied Piper
Re: tune-learning sessions?
i like the way this is going!
mm
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
I've been a big advocate of a learning session, or "slow session" as they're sometimes referred to, at our local pub for a long time -- and finally one got started on the second to the last Tuesday of the month. The only thing I wish there were more of though, (and I'm guilty of this myself,) is to have more experienced players helping out. I once witnessed a Comhaltas session in Ennis where Sonny Murray and a couple of other fellas were leading the tunes and providing a great example at a learning session. The difference there being that most of the participants were under 15. Here in the SF Bay Area they're nearly all of legal drinking age.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: tune-learning sessions?
A word of caution about tune-learning or slow sessions: it would be best for the main session to be a separate event, on a different night or at least in a different pub.
If you have a slow session right before the regular paced session, the regular session may soon be overrun by the slow session. Actually, it is at the point where the slow sessioners turn into medium sessioners. But you quickly lose the focus of the regular session.
The caveat being that the slow session will be popular and attract a bunch of people to it so as to out-number the regulars in the main session.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Jode
Re: tune-learning sessions?
thanks everyone for your input.
plan is for now:
once-a-month tune-learning session, followed by slow-session (getting used to making up sets 'on the fly', recognising tunes as they are played, ...).
this all in the light of the weekly sessions elsewhere.
i do understand your point, jode, about the session being overrun by the slow/medium session and losing the interest of the regular players.
(i actually hope some of the regulars might be interested in joining the 'tune-learning' bit for the tunes' sake)
i hope this is going to work out.
mm
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Jill Elliot of Bristol runs tune-learning sessions for fiddle twice-weekly for players of all standards from beginners to advanced. See her website http://www.jillefiddledd.com/ for further details.
Trevor
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Trevor Jennings
Re: tune-learning sessions?
MM...good luck and let us know how it goes! It sounds like it could be very successful. And keeping some session regulars involved will make it more communal.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Jode
Re: tune-learning sessions?
hey helb! what's a nice girl like you doing in a place like this? better watch out or you'll be hooked...
see you at the maltings!
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by rog
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Several folks around here (Santa Fe, NM) have hosted slow sessions, tune learning sessions, etc. They seem to be short-lived ( several months running) but they have certainly been useful to me and I attend as often as possible. I guess mostly I wanted to say, don't discouraged if yours turn out also to be short-lived - it doesn't mean they weren't extremely useful.
The same kind of thing (beginners and experienced and how to mix) always comes up in folk dance groups, too, and all the discussions on this site about etiquette, what kind of group, how to integrate new folks, etc, etc, etc, would be the same if "folk dance" was substituted for "ITM", so it seems to be the human condition, and therefore extreme variability seems to be the norm!
But a tune learning session is a good idea, and whoever attends will be really grateful. So keep up the great work.
Cathy
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by cj
Re: tune-learning sessions?
A very interesting thread - I think the slow session is definitely the way to go. There are interesting aspects though such as "how do you keep a slow session slow?" Experience shows that as people learn tunes they always want to play them at normal speed. The Wednesday Culturlann session in Monkstown started slow but as the years went by and a couple of hundred tunes were learnt it soon became a normal speed session. To cater for newer musicians a dedicated slow session was started on Tuesdays but again as time went on the pace increased. A solution has now been found where every 4 months or so a number of sets of newer tunes are introduced and these are kept at a slower speed irrespective of the competencies of musicians present. This means that for the first hour and a half the session is slow/medium. After that tunes are played at whatever speed musicians prefer. The approach seems to work quite well as the final part of the night allows people to play tunes tunes they'd learnt during earlier slow sessions at the normal speed.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Bannerman
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Shrog, am I one of the endless patients? Wait, no, that can't be right - i'm told my condition is curable if only I were to make the effort!
%7)
Let's see if we can get slow sesh going again this thursday. I'll harrangue people.
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by Q
Re: tune-learning sessions?
bannerman,
i guess you're trying to warn about the same thing as jode:
or the regular session would loose intrest from experienced player (jode)
or the slow would evolve into a regular one.
i guess keeping both seperate and making the aims clear should help avoid these things.
anyway, if the slowsession turns into a regular one, this would mean that the goal is reached: the musicians involved in the slow-session are upto playing at regular level!
and if no new interest comes, why not? and if new blood knocks on the door, we just start all over again, yes?
mm
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
maybe we can just wait for how everything eventually turns out ...
one step at a time.
mm
# Posted on January 11th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
any one out there fancy starting a tune learning session in
North Wales ?
# Posted on January 12th 2005 by banjoian
Re: tune-learning sessions?
I'll come out of the woodwork for a post...
Some of us in Longmont, Colorado have been going to our same tune-learning session for more than three years, now. It's a great way to learn and teach. Everybody who comes ends up teaching a tune eventually, and we all learn more tunes. Then the added benefit: Several of us go to other sessions, and we have a few more tunes in common since we learn them together. Sometimes we bring our kids, too. Starting three years ago, as a beginning piper, this tune-learning session has been a great way for me to eventually get to the point where I can now play more tunes at speed, and learn more tunes more quickly, by ear.
So, do it, and keep it going. We do.
All The Best,
Dirk
# Posted on January 12th 2005 by dirk
Re: tune-learning sessions?
Interesting to see this thread on the very night I started my own such session. Just returned, and I'm very pleased with the results. The pub owner was jazzed about having music in his pub - his cronies are now hopped up about having their kids come in to learn - and the regular punters were extremely receptive and appreciative, despite the jaunty nature inherent of a 'learning' session.
As for the actual musicians - I set it up specifically because there's a group of them in my area who just need an opportunity to sit down and play with others at a more relaxed pace than what the regular sessions offer. Everyone enjoyed the exchange of information and opportunity to join in on the action. Gave me a chance to play the pipes a bit too!
I remember attending such a regular session in my 2nd year of playing the fiddle - though it was not formally billed as such, it was conducted in such a manner that I was able to play what I was working on without feeling intimidated, and it got me a) used to playing along with (and *listening* to) others, and b) comfortable playing in front of an audience. It takes more time to get used to doing those things if all you have available is a faster session. It gave me more motivation to practice and prepare each week, that's for certain.
For backers, I am trying to make sure that I have somebody experienced on hand to help get the chords sorted out - quite educational actually for everyone in attendance.
Secretly, I really set it up because it's the closest irish pub to where I live and I'm sick of driving all over Hell's half acre to play. I'm hoping to organically grow my own local session.
# Posted on January 12th 2005 by _Steph_
Re: tune-learning sessions?
I've been going to a local slow session for 2 years now...the first time I went I'd been playing flute for all of about 3-4 months, but I had played whistle off and on for the prior decade. It allowed me to learn from a more experienced flute player who hosts the session just how to play the dang thing, and I've greatly increased the number of tunes I know (I'm now quite comfortably at the "I don't know this reel's name but it goes like this" stage).
One suggestion - once a month is a long time for a newer session player to go between sessions. How about twice per month? I'd say two shorter sessions per month are much more helpful than one per month. Also, grab a tape recorder or use the mic and a CD on your computer and play through the most frequently played tunes at your regular session - play through them once at a painfully slow speed then up to session speed. Our slow session has 4 tapes like this, and they're invaluable...it gives the players something to practice with inbetween sessions.
Eric
# Posted on January 12th 2005 by Jayhawk
Re: tune-learning sessions?
eric,
i think once-a-month is about all we can manage for now.
most of us still do have a professional and/or family life!
i have both, but almost all my spare time goes into music (of any kind) so, for me it wouldn't really be a problem (wife and kids might object though).
i am going to 'direct' these sessions, hopefully together with at least one other muso, but it will be located elsewhere (see 'paul's kitchen' under the session section).
about the mic/C'ter thing: i made some mp3-recordings of top-session-tunes to distribute by email, but i suggest to every new soul to bring some kind of recording device for this purpose. i'm not going to hold their hands, the biggest effort has to come from them!
when everything else fails, they can always turn to 'one of us' to play the tune for them to tape, if need be, at the regular session.
mm
# Posted on January 12th 2005 by MM
Re: tune-learning sessions?
We're pretty lucky here. The local Hibernians let us use their hall hold two slow sessions monthly where we teach new tunes the 1st hour and polish ones we've already learned the 2nd. We also have our regular montly session where we start with a even pace the first hour and encourage our slow session players to join in. Of course, after that 1st hour, it's full speed ahead.
We're very fortunate to have some excellent players here who are patient and love to teach tunes. Other things we are doing is as mentioned above, recording and distributing MP3's of commons session tunes and encouraging the new players to bring recorders to all sessions.
# Posted on January 12th 2005 by RogueFiddler