I'm assuming this term has it's origins in Ireland. I've been around ITM most of my life and playing at sessions in the states for a few years. Yet I never heard "Punter" until I joined the internet ITM scene. Anyone know where it comes from?
I might be wrong but I always thought it originated amongst the betting fraternity i.e the horse racing and dogs etc. "Punt" is Irish for "Pound" and you here people say or ask "fancy a quick punt?" or words to that effect.
It's a betting term. A punter is someone who has a punt or a bet on, say, a horse. Over time it's come to mean an Ordinary Joe (or Josephine), a member of the public. So a punter at a session simply means someone who's not there to play music.
It's certainly been used in the west of Scotland for decades to mean some ordinary, more likely working class, guy, so does it have the same meaning in the north of Ireland?
Yeah, same type of thing Danny. Although since the switch to the Euro maybe we need to update the term to Euro-er. Hmm, maybe not; sounds like someone throwing up.
This might be of interest particularly to French-speaking Conan if he's not found it already. Dictionary.com says it's British slang from the French "ponter", from obsolete "pont", past participle of "pondre" = "to put" (obsolete), "to lay an egg", from Old French, "to lay an egg", from Latin "pnere". See "apo-" in Indo-European Roots. I'd be inclined to believe the French origins rather than it having anything to do with the Irish punt/pound. "I say, tell the egg-layers to stop clapping to the music"
We had this discussion in a thread earlier on this year. The first person I heard using it apart from as a betting term was Billy Connolly in his early folk-club days. Have a listen to his "crucifixion" story, [ recorded just before Michael Parkinson discovered him]. I'm sure you'll find it there, and this would be about 1973, give or take a year or two.
Kenny, it was certainly used in Drumchapel, with the aforementioned meaning, pre-Connolly. To that I can attest.
But Connolly says something like, and I paraphrase, "Thur's nuthin' bit deid punters aw' walkin' aboot wi' thur beds under thur airms"..in reference to Lazarus, I believe.
LOL @ "On apprend quelque chose de nouveau chaque jour". Must practise that one for every day use, spoken with that really bad Geordie-French accent I used to use in school French lessons to piss my teacher off: "On apron kelk'uh shoowuhz de noovohwa shack djewa".
Conan, would Danny really throttle you? I always pictured him as looking something like a flute-playing Rab C with a string vest, stained jacket and bruised forehead, but I saw a photo of him recently and he looks so... unassuming. I was shocked and stunned! Or is that just the public face he uses to throw people off guard, and he's really a hardened headbutting machine?
BTW, unrelated, had to larff last night at Helen's gig at the name of one of Beneche's self-penned reels - Brittany Speared. And yes, he meant what you think he meant.
Speaking of shakey eggs, in the music store the other day, I saw shakey egg with a guitar pick attached to it, so guitar players, while strumming, could simultaneously play a shakey egg! How is that for a breakthrough innovation.
AL Brown
I've been holding a shakee-egg in the same hand with the tipper whilst playing the bodhran for years now. I've also been known to play the shruti-box with my feet at the same time. (this is scaring the lads in Dublin I bet)
Where does the term "Punter" come from?
Where does the term "Punter" come from?
I'm assuming this term has it's origins in Ireland. I've been around ITM most of my life and playing at sessions in the states for a few years. Yet I never heard "Punter" until I joined the internet ITM scene. Anyone know where it comes from?
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by meemtp
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
I might be wrong but I always thought it originated amongst the betting fraternity i.e the horse racing and dogs etc. "Punt" is Irish for "Pound" and you here people say or ask "fancy a quick punt?" or words to that effect.
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Johnny Jay
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
It's a betting term. A punter is someone who has a punt or a bet on, say, a horse. Over time it's come to mean an Ordinary Joe (or Josephine), a member of the public. So a punter at a session simply means someone who's not there to play music.
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
That's more or less what I thought, Conan, but you put it so much better than me.
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Johnny Jay
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
It takes one to know one :¬)
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
It's certainly been used in the west of Scotland for decades to mean some ordinary, more likely working class, guy, so does it have the same meaning in the north of Ireland?
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Rudall the time
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
Yeah, same type of thing Danny. Although since the switch to the Euro maybe we need to update the term to Euro-er. Hmm, maybe not; sounds like someone throwing up.
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
This might be of interest particularly to French-speaking Conan if he's not found it already. Dictionary.com says it's British slang from the French "ponter", from obsolete "pont", past participle of "pondre" = "to put" (obsolete), "to lay an egg", from Old French, "to lay an egg", from Latin "pnere". See "apo-" in Indo-European Roots. I'd be inclined to believe the French origins rather than it having anything to do with the Irish punt/pound. "I say, tell the egg-layers to stop clapping to the music"
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Dr. Dow
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
LOL :¬)
Sacre bleu! Je savais pas ça. On apprend quelque chose de nouveau chaque jour.
Personally I find your version of the etymology a tad shakey, (hence the term "shakey egg").
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
We had this discussion in a thread earlier on this year. The first person I heard using it apart from as a betting term was Billy Connolly in his early folk-club days. Have a listen to his "crucifixion" story, [ recorded just before Michael Parkinson discovered him]. I'm sure you'll find it there, and this would be about 1973, give or take a year or two.
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Kenny
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
Ah! so it's official, then. Shakey-egg shakers are not musicians but punters.
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Rudall the time
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
Q.E.D.
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
Kenny, it was certainly used in Drumchapel, with the aforementioned meaning, pre-Connolly. To that I can attest.
But Connolly says something like, and I paraphrase, "Thur's nuthin' bit deid punters aw' walkin' aboot wi' thur beds under thur airms"..in reference to Lazarus, I believe.
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Rudall the time
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
LOL @ "On apprend quelque chose de nouveau chaque jour". Must practise that one for every day use, spoken with that really bad Geordie-French accent I used to use in school French lessons to piss my teacher off: "On apron kelk'uh shoowuhz de noovohwa shack djewa".
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Dr. Dow
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
haha don't get me started. Tha lot reminded me of a Viz character.
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
Haha, Viz, that "old favourite" of Danny's (not!)
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Dr. Dow
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
Maybe Danny's nickname should henceforth be Biffa or Sid or somesuch.
He would throttle me, of course.
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
Hahahaha!
Oops :-|
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Dr. Dow
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
Conan, would Danny really throttle you? I always pictured him as looking something like a flute-playing Rab C with a string vest, stained jacket and bruised forehead, but I saw a photo of him recently and he looks so... unassuming. I was shocked and stunned! Or is that just the public face he uses to throw people off guard, and he's really a hardened headbutting machine?
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Dr. Dow
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
Ach this isn't fair. Danny's a lovely guy in real life, or so he says.
I'm off home now before this gets out of hand.
Bon courage mon vieux
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
...or Roger Mellie. Har bliddy har. If you're up for a good dose of juvenile humour, you can still subscribe to Viz:
http://www.magazine-group.co.uk/magazines.php?id=263
BTW, unrelated, had to larff last night at Helen's gig at the name of one of Beneche's self-penned reels - Brittany Speared. And yes, he meant what you think he meant.
# Posted on October 26th 2004 by Rudall the time
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
As a founding member of Continuity Comhaltas we refer to punters as civilians - i.e. not armed with an instrument or singing voice.
# Posted on October 27th 2004 by breandan
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
Speaking of shakey eggs, in the music store the other day, I saw shakey egg with a guitar pick attached to it, so guitar players, while strumming, could simultaneously play a shakey egg! How is that for a breakthrough innovation.
AL Brown
# Posted on October 29th 2004 by AlBrown
Re: Where does the term "Punter" come from?
I've been holding a shakee-egg in the same hand with the tipper whilst playing the bodhran for years now. I've also been known to play the shruti-box with my feet at the same time. (this is scaring the lads in Dublin I bet)
# Posted on October 29th 2004 by Phantom Button