The guitarists here tend just to do accompaniment, but I like tunes played on guitar actually. I play tunes on mandola sometimes when I want a change from backing or if the general wash of accompaniment noise becomes a bit much. In that case I ornament with hammer-ons and pull-offs, but I've recently got into doing more picked triplets than I used to because I like the sound of them - they sound more impressive than unpicked ornaments and give tunes a nice lift.
I play the melody on the tunes that I know, but I'm playing strictly for my own gratification. Most of the time I can barely hear myself above the fiddles, whistles, flutes and boxes.
Ornamentation? I make a lot of mistakes. I call them my ornamentation.
As far as Scottish music has been concerned and, I believe,for Irish too, the guitar was "tolerated" and just a simple accompaniment was all that was desired by the melody players. Some of the older players would say "You'll get aw these young yins trying to play melody and that fancy stuff but that's no' whit we want". Of course, things have moved on now and much more imaginative and sensitive "backing" is tolerated and, indeed, expected. Melody playing is also more common but I'd still say that it depends where you are. I like to listen to melody on guitar and I "noodle" away at home but I would probably stick to "melody instruments" and the CBOM variety in a session. Mind you, that's probably just because I find them easier to play.
That's interesting John J, because a lot of
the Irish "purists" would prefer that the guitar played melody as opposed to backing stating the music is primarily melodic, for instance, Seamus Duffy apparently has no problem with guitar melody, it's the whole chordal thing he objects to - which is as good an opinion as any, not mine though.
Personally I love the "lift" of going from melody to accompaniment (not saying I can provide that lift. I just love it.) a la Arty McGlynn.
Are any of the tunes submitted here posted with Guitar in mind ?
It's also one of the things I like about Irish music, i.e more emphasis on the melody. In Scottish music, they all want to(though not exclusively)introduce harmonies, second and third parts and unecessary(in my opinion)variations and arrangements to otherwise straight forward and beautiful tunes.
I alays enjoyed hearing a couple of my guitar playing friends flat-pick, or even fingerpick, a tune. The real challenge was keeping everyone one else from jumping into the tune too quickly so that their (the guitarists) efforts could be heard properly.
In order to be heard playing melody on guitar you need either a small session or a willingness by the fiddles, banjo's, accordians etc to pull back and give the guitarist some space (the guitarist isn't usually seen as worthy of this sort reverence).
You could take a look at Dan Mozell's website - he has a good article on playing Irish/Scottish tunes and there are guitar friendly tunes in notation and tab - www.danmozell.com/d-mozell.htm
Very interesting here. Didnt think so many people were into flatpicking.
Well, I for my part, love tunes on guitar. For some reason it just has a different, to me, nicer sound, than say banjo, mandola, mandolin. But without a doubt it is far more difficult. Especially if you play in dadgad tuning because you have to move up the fret much higher. If you want take a listen into this sample here --> "http://home.arcor.de/alfonso16/hp/html/the_album.html";
It's the 4. sample called "Guitar duo - Crowley's".
You can listen to two jigs played on dadgad guitar by a good friend of mine and I back him up with dadgad aswell.
When I break out and plug in my flying-V I'm a flatpicker and find there aren't to many of us. The distortion pedal is frowned upon but as soon as I break into "Cat Scratch Fever" people are digin it. Just kidding.
Occasionally I finger pick a ballad with emhasis on the melody. Once I learn a tune on the whistle I find it I can learn it fairly quickly then on either guitar (or Banjo). I try to play a little slower at first so that when the pace picks up I can hang, doesn't alway's work, the music seems to sound faster on guitar...or is it just me. Getting up to speed isn't alway's possible in my case on guitar and as for ornaments...The occasional triplet, slight bending and tremolo is about all I can muster, Cross-picking and the actual sustain of the instumnet do have a bit of a ornamentative effect I think as well. I do like to switch-up and add the ocasional chord, usually an abrievated one. Depends. Actually, I really stink as a chord player when it comes to ITM.
I've only concentrated on picking the melody relatively recently(about two years) and found my backing has (hopefully)improved as a result.Obviously it can only help as you get to know the tunes better,but I think it's important to spend enough time with each tune to make it your own.It doesn't really bother me that my efforts are normally drowned out in a session,although some friends are encouraging me to go back to playing chords behind them.I have to say I'm really enjoying playing the tunes.I've found piping tunes can be useful to try and start with-working out your triplets with the second note of three as the "dampened" note one or two frets above.If you try and avoid open strings it gives a better overall volume IMO.You can throw in pull offs and hammer ons as well-which can only add I think to contributing some uniquely guitar sounding accidentals.I suppose if you're performing in a group it's worth arranging counter melodies.Rolls I've found difficult to sustain and I chicken out by staying with picked triplets probably too much,but it's great fun.
BegF I think that is the ideal situation, either tune to chords or tune right the way through the set. The opposite, chords to tune, well I've selfishly done it a few times and don;t think it was appreciated!
Guitar Flatpicking
Guitar Flatpicking
What are peoples thoughts on the guitar playing the melody first before changing to accompaniment in a set.
Do any of the guitarists here play melody (on the guitar) in sessions ?
What kind of ornamentation do you add ? Or do you think it’s better to play the straight melody ?
# Posted on June 3rd 2004 by BegF
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
The guitarists here tend just to do accompaniment, but I like tunes played on guitar actually. I play tunes on mandola sometimes when I want a change from backing or if the general wash of accompaniment noise becomes a bit much. In that case I ornament with hammer-ons and pull-offs, but I've recently got into doing more picked triplets than I used to because I like the sound of them - they sound more impressive than unpicked ornaments and give tunes a nice lift.
# Posted on June 3rd 2004 by Dr. Dow
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
I play the melody on the tunes that I know, but I'm playing strictly for my own gratification. Most of the time I can barely hear myself above the fiddles, whistles, flutes and boxes.
Ornamentation? I make a lot of mistakes. I call them my ornamentation.
# Posted on June 3rd 2004 by tocotodo
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
As far as Scottish music has been concerned and, I believe,for Irish too, the guitar was "tolerated" and just a simple accompaniment was all that was desired by the melody players. Some of the older players would say "You'll get aw these young yins trying to play melody and that fancy stuff but that's no' whit we want". Of course, things have moved on now and much more imaginative and sensitive "backing" is tolerated and, indeed, expected. Melody playing is also more common but I'd still say that it depends where you are. I like to listen to melody on guitar and I "noodle" away at home but I would probably stick to "melody instruments" and the CBOM variety in a session. Mind you, that's probably just because I find them easier to play.
John
# Posted on June 3rd 2004 by John J.
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
That's called Free Jazz, tocotodo !!
That's interesting John J, because a lot of
the Irish "purists" would prefer that the guitar played melody as opposed to backing stating the music is primarily melodic, for instance, Seamus Duffy apparently has no problem with guitar melody, it's the whole chordal thing he objects to - which is as good an opinion as any, not mine though.
Personally I love the "lift" of going from melody to accompaniment (not saying I can provide that lift. I just love it.) a la Arty McGlynn.
Are any of the tunes submitted here posted with Guitar in mind ?
# Posted on June 3rd 2004 by BegF
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
That's probably true now in Ireland but they didn't use to like melody too much in Scottish sessions.
# Posted on June 3rd 2004 by John J.
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
Oh I'm not disputing it, I'm saying it's interesting.
I believe that melody players in Scotland were far more open to chordal accompaniment than their Irish counterparts.
# Posted on June 4th 2004 by BegF
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
It's also one of the things I like about Irish music, i.e more emphasis on the melody. In Scottish music, they all want to(though not exclusively)introduce harmonies, second and third parts and unecessary(in my opinion)variations and arrangements to otherwise straight forward and beautiful tunes.
# Posted on June 4th 2004 by John J.
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
But, having said that, I'm not a purist either. :=)
# Posted on June 4th 2004 by John J.
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
It would seem to me that a big problem with flatpicking a guitar in a session would be the lack of volume. No one would hear it.
# Posted on June 4th 2004 by griffith
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
I alays enjoyed hearing a couple of my guitar playing friends flat-pick, or even fingerpick, a tune. The real challenge was keeping everyone one else from jumping into the tune too quickly so that their (the guitarists) efforts could be heard properly.
# Posted on June 4th 2004 by Bill Reeder
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
In order to be heard playing melody on guitar you need either a small session or a willingness by the fiddles, banjo's, accordians etc to pull back and give the guitarist some space (the guitarist isn't usually seen as worthy of this sort reverence).
You could take a look at Dan Mozell's website - he has a good article on playing Irish/Scottish tunes and there are guitar friendly tunes in notation and tab - www.danmozell.com/d-mozell.htm
# Posted on June 4th 2004 by Cuso
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
John you've grown an extra nose!
# Posted on June 4th 2004 by Dr. Dow
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
Very interesting here. Didnt think so many people were into flatpicking.
Well, I for my part, love tunes on guitar. For some reason it just has a different, to me, nicer sound, than say banjo, mandola, mandolin. But without a doubt it is far more difficult. Especially if you play in dadgad tuning because you have to move up the fret much higher. If you want take a listen into this sample here --> "http://home.arcor.de/alfonso16/hp/html/the_album.html";
It's the 4. sample called "Guitar duo - Crowley's".
You can listen to two jigs played on dadgad guitar by a good friend of mine and I back him up with dadgad aswell.
Cheers
Brian
# Posted on June 4th 2004 by AlFonso
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
I'm sorry, the link doesnt work this way.
--> " http://home.arcor.de/alfonso16/hp/html/the_album.html "
# Posted on June 4th 2004 by AlFonso
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
When I break out and plug in my flying-V I'm a flatpicker and find there aren't to many of us. The distortion pedal is frowned upon but as soon as I break into "Cat Scratch Fever" people are digin it. Just kidding.
Occasionally I finger pick a ballad with emhasis on the melody. Once I learn a tune on the whistle I find it I can learn it fairly quickly then on either guitar (or Banjo). I try to play a little slower at first so that when the pace picks up I can hang, doesn't alway's work, the music seems to sound faster on guitar...or is it just me. Getting up to speed isn't alway's possible in my case on guitar and as for ornaments...The occasional triplet, slight bending and tremolo is about all I can muster, Cross-picking and the actual sustain of the instumnet do have a bit of a ornamentative effect I think as well. I do like to switch-up and add the ocasional chord, usually an abrievated one. Depends. Actually, I really stink as a chord player when it comes to ITM.
My head and heart are in the melody.
# Posted on June 5th 2004 by Chef Paul
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
I've only concentrated on picking the melody relatively recently(about two years) and found my backing has (hopefully)improved as a result.Obviously it can only help as you get to know the tunes better,but I think it's important to spend enough time with each tune to make it your own.It doesn't really bother me that my efforts are normally drowned out in a session,although some friends are encouraging me to go back to playing chords behind them.I have to say I'm really enjoying playing the tunes.I've found piping tunes can be useful to try and start with-working out your triplets with the second note of three as the "dampened" note one or two frets above.If you try and avoid open strings it gives a better overall volume IMO.You can throw in pull offs and hammer ons as well-which can only add I think to contributing some uniquely guitar sounding accidentals.I suppose if you're performing in a group it's worth arranging counter melodies.Rolls I've found difficult to sustain and I chicken out by staying with picked triplets probably too much,but it's great fun.
# Posted on June 5th 2004 by horaldo
Re: Guitar Flatpicking
BegF I think that is the ideal situation, either tune to chords or tune right the way through the set. The opposite, chords to tune, well I've selfishly done it a few times and don;t think it was appreciated!
# Posted on May 5th 2010 by Paudy