I’m a rather mechanically incline person with my fair share of tools & wood working skills and I apologize that this is a wee long but as I have never done anything like this before, I was really hoping I could get some pointers.
Recently I had the chance to get my hands on a slightly damaged Mid-East 18” x 4” Rosewood tunable frame that I have fixed with some glue and is in good shape now.
I then removed all remnants of the old head from the frame and have sanded off all the old glue that helped to hold that on so it is all clean now.
I then got a 26” thick weight goat skin from Elderly’s for about $25.00, (which is part of why I’m doing this too so I can try a thick head)
An yes just to be clear, this is going to be a practice/spare/backup drum so I don’t expect the best sound from it but for all that this is going cost I figure why not take a whack at it.
The head is about as processed as I think it needs to be so I think the next step would be to soak it in water for at least a day or two and then fairly loosely but with a bit of snugness, try to as evenly as I can get it on the frame.
The few issues I am worried about though are.
1: The climate in my area right now is so dry that even with a good soaking, my current Bodhran will dry tight in only one or to two songs of playing, so I’m wondering how I might keep this head from drying to fast an causing me a problem a result as I try to install it.
Also I’m wondering how I might glue it the way it was before, especially if the head has to be this wet, does anyone have any recommendations as to what kind of glue I could use?
Or should I not even try to do this an just load it up with tacks?
To be honest because of how cheap this head is I would think that gluing it would be best but then that does kinda presents all of the problems I have listed and again the right glue I think is going to be key for this so again does anyone have any suggestions?
Then lastly and I know this is probably about the hardest one to reply to but, any tips on how I can do all this and get the cover strap back on too?
Now for all of these for instance I had these ideas:
If I can get the right glue, apply the glue to the frame and as quick as I can from the water, take the wet head and lay it over the frame and then use a long cloth strap clamp and wrap it around where the head meets the frame and do this loosely at first so I can then move the head around till I get about a 1/8 to a 1/4 even settling drop just at the edge and with a good even edge to center drop of what ever that produces to the middle, but all as evenly tensioned as I can get it.
Then once I have the head where I want it, I can snug the strap down good an tight and take the whole drum and place it in a large plastic bag with a few well soaked rags underneath it and close that up as best as possible.
My idea with this is to keep the head from drying out as best as I can an pulling on the glue till the glue has a chance to cure.
Now I know all this moisture will not help that glue cure any faster but if the head dries out and pulls it from the drum, especially as its curing and/or especially unevenly, that’s going to ruin everything so hopefully and again if the glue is the right type, my way will let it cure enough at least till I can get the strap on.
Then I will let that sit for a day or two and if the head seems to be really tightening up too much, perhaps I can open it and wet the head again and/or re-wet the rags
Then after a few days take it out and really soak up the head and keep doing this if it seems to be trying out then apply the strap around and the tacks.
Also just to point out, I did think about putting in some tacks while the glue was drying that I could pull out later to install the strap, but what I was afraid of was if the head does dry out to much and starts to pull on just those, that it might deform what ever evenness I may have been able to achieve.
At least if this does happen with my method my hope is that if the glue hasn’t cured yet, that it might let it slip a little and thus do this more evenly and then I can always take up that slack with the adjustable ring.
Lastly just to ask about this, the head that I got seems to have one side that is smoother then the other so I would assume the rougher side should go on the inside.
Also I can see that it kinda has what I think is a back bone mark in the middle and I think that should run from the top to the bottom of the drum when I install it, correct?
Well again sorry that this was all a bit long but I would really appreciate any help I could get.
You only need to soak the skin for a couple of hours. If you use ordinary wood-glue it will dry as the skin dries, The tacks will stop it pulling away, but you don't really need glue. Don't put it on too tightly at first -- just a slight sag will become very tight when it dries out. Measure the skin when it is dry and again when it is wet to see the expansion. As for the spine mark, there is no top or bottom on a drum, you hold it whichever way you want. A bit of hand-cream rubbed in will stop it getting too dry. You can also use Dubbin, but that tends to hold bits of grit, and doesn't smell as nice. There are a few videos on youtube if you search around a bit. The main thing is to get the tension even radially, but it is like anything else: give it a try. If it works, then fine. You can always take it off again and re-fit it. Good luck.
I wouldn't glue it at all, but tack it to the rim. Glueing is not precise enough and potentially very messy too.
When I skin bodhrans, I soak the skin then stretch it over the drum, leaving a sag of around 1 - inches in the middle depending on the thickness of the skin. Then I use a big rubber band (the sort offices use for holding files together) and secure that between the rim and the groove where the tacks go. I then tie strong string in the groove all the way round and secure it with a dowl so I can tighten or loosen as I wish. More elastic bands to hold the lot in place and then I leave it.
If it needs adjusting as it dried I upend the drum and pour water in until the skin is supple again and adjust the tension accordingly and rubber band it all up again. When you're happy with it and it's dry take off the rubber bands and string and the skin will stay in place. Tack in on and you're done.
I really would not use glue.
The smooth side of the skin goes on the outside, and the back of the goat can go where you want it to; top to bottom sounds about right to me.
Have you thought of doing it in the bathroom, steaming it up before you start ? That should take care of the dry atmosphere.
I replaced my banjo head recently - it's not rocket science.
I'm glad there isn't a camera on my computer !
Did you ever hear of the old lady who decided she would liven up proceedings at her old people's home by doing a streak, except she wasn't quite that fast.........?
"Did you see that, Elmer ?"
"Well, I don't know quite what it was, but whatever she was wearing hadn't been ironed ! ".
'Nuff said.
Just a few things to bring up though as I'm a bit confused by the talk of a groove.
Now please keep in mind I don’t have much info to go on here as I don’t have anything like a wide knowledge of Bodhran construction or maybe I’m miss-understanding but just to point out, this frame does not have any kind of a groove to it.
In looking at it bare, on the top it is just as straight and smooth on the sides and under where the head is affixed as it is on the bottom half.
So there is no groove that might help in the process as I think it was described. I can see how that would work if it had a groove as that would add the resistance to shifting by rubbing against the groove but being smooth I think I may need something stronger to keep if from shifting around as I do the man handling of doing the tacking job.
Also as far as the gluing and I’m not trying to argue but really more to be educated but.
Previously, the tacks were spread apart by about 2-1/2 inches, there were 28 tacks for an 18” round drum.
Via the manufacturer I think as it was glued that this glue was doing the main holding and the tacks were more of a extra support as well as a way to keep the decorative strap in place.
Also to point out and I hope this doesn’t come off as cocky by as I was a rock drummer for about 20 years, as such I have changed and tuned my fair share of heads and as we all know there are typically not many lugs or fixed points of tension to a drum of this sort either, but that the key is the rim that is built into the head that makes that not much of big deal so in a sense this recreates a rather evenly attached head much like the glue method would one, if you get what I mean, which I wouldn’t get with skin such as I have now unless I used a lot of tacks.
At any rate I guess what I’m trying to say is that I kinda get why the manufacture used glue as if not, especially without a groove, you would have to add a lot of tacks much like I see in some of the high end drums or else your going get some uneven tones under tension with a 2-1/2 spread and also not as good of a attachment support too as don’t forget, these heads nor the one I bought are of very high quality. Heck I can say that I was even able to tear the old heads skin quite easy just by hand.
As well even if you did go with that many tack method, again without a groove, it could be very hard to get like 80 tacks installed without ending up with some shifting or uneven tension, unless you are very skilled at that.
Or maybe I should say I know it will be for me at least.
At any rate, I greatly appreciate all the input and there was much here that I will use but I think I might still go with the glue method an re-tack it as it was, and I think I might even just try Elmers wood glue as that does clean up pretty well.
My only concern is that I just hope that with the wet head it will still affix to the skin and cure eventually and I’m hoping that with the wide band strap and the method of letting it sit for a while in the way I described, this will happen.
Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
Hello all
I’m a rather mechanically incline person with my fair share of tools & wood working skills and I apologize that this is a wee long but as I have never done anything like this before, I was really hoping I could get some pointers.
Recently I had the chance to get my hands on a slightly damaged Mid-East 18” x 4” Rosewood tunable frame that I have fixed with some glue and is in good shape now.
I then removed all remnants of the old head from the frame and have sanded off all the old glue that helped to hold that on so it is all clean now.
I then got a 26” thick weight goat skin from Elderly’s for about $25.00, (which is part of why I’m doing this too so I can try a thick head)
An yes just to be clear, this is going to be a practice/spare/backup drum so I don’t expect the best sound from it but for all that this is going cost I figure why not take a whack at it.
The head is about as processed as I think it needs to be so I think the next step would be to soak it in water for at least a day or two and then fairly loosely but with a bit of snugness, try to as evenly as I can get it on the frame.
The few issues I am worried about though are.
1: The climate in my area right now is so dry that even with a good soaking, my current Bodhran will dry tight in only one or to two songs of playing, so I’m wondering how I might keep this head from drying to fast an causing me a problem a result as I try to install it.
Also I’m wondering how I might glue it the way it was before, especially if the head has to be this wet, does anyone have any recommendations as to what kind of glue I could use?
Or should I not even try to do this an just load it up with tacks?
To be honest because of how cheap this head is I would think that gluing it would be best but then that does kinda presents all of the problems I have listed and again the right glue I think is going to be key for this so again does anyone have any suggestions?
Then lastly and I know this is probably about the hardest one to reply to but, any tips on how I can do all this and get the cover strap back on too?
Now for all of these for instance I had these ideas:
If I can get the right glue, apply the glue to the frame and as quick as I can from the water, take the wet head and lay it over the frame and then use a long cloth strap clamp and wrap it around where the head meets the frame and do this loosely at first so I can then move the head around till I get about a 1/8 to a 1/4 even settling drop just at the edge and with a good even edge to center drop of what ever that produces to the middle, but all as evenly tensioned as I can get it.
Then once I have the head where I want it, I can snug the strap down good an tight and take the whole drum and place it in a large plastic bag with a few well soaked rags underneath it and close that up as best as possible.
My idea with this is to keep the head from drying out as best as I can an pulling on the glue till the glue has a chance to cure.
Now I know all this moisture will not help that glue cure any faster but if the head dries out and pulls it from the drum, especially as its curing and/or especially unevenly, that’s going to ruin everything so hopefully and again if the glue is the right type, my way will let it cure enough at least till I can get the strap on.
Then I will let that sit for a day or two and if the head seems to be really tightening up too much, perhaps I can open it and wet the head again and/or re-wet the rags
Then after a few days take it out and really soak up the head and keep doing this if it seems to be trying out then apply the strap around and the tacks.
Also just to point out, I did think about putting in some tacks while the glue was drying that I could pull out later to install the strap, but what I was afraid of was if the head does dry out to much and starts to pull on just those, that it might deform what ever evenness I may have been able to achieve.
At least if this does happen with my method my hope is that if the glue hasn’t cured yet, that it might let it slip a little and thus do this more evenly and then I can always take up that slack with the adjustable ring.
Lastly just to ask about this, the head that I got seems to have one side that is smoother then the other so I would assume the rougher side should go on the inside.
Also I can see that it kinda has what I think is a back bone mark in the middle and I think that should run from the top to the bottom of the drum when I install it, correct?
Well again sorry that this was all a bit long but I would really appreciate any help I could get.
Thanks to all.
# Posted on March 7th 2010 by RyanAir2112
Re: Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
You only need to soak the skin for a couple of hours. If you use ordinary wood-glue it will dry as the skin dries, The tacks will stop it pulling away, but you don't really need glue. Don't put it on too tightly at first -- just a slight sag will become very tight when it dries out. Measure the skin when it is dry and again when it is wet to see the expansion. As for the spine mark, there is no top or bottom on a drum, you hold it whichever way you want. A bit of hand-cream rubbed in will stop it getting too dry. You can also use Dubbin, but that tends to hold bits of grit, and doesn't smell as nice. There are a few videos on youtube if you search around a bit. The main thing is to get the tension even radially, but it is like anything else: give it a try. If it works, then fine. You can always take it off again and re-fit it. Good luck.
# Posted on March 7th 2010 by gam
Re: Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
Yeah water, or as Conor Long says: "Some people use beer, but that's just a waste, water works fine".
# Posted on March 7th 2010 by Jwalkert
Re: Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
First catch your goat.
# Posted on March 7th 2010 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
I wouldn't glue it at all, but tack it to the rim. Glueing is not precise enough and potentially very messy too.
When I skin bodhrans, I soak the skin then stretch it over the drum, leaving a sag of around 1 - inches in the middle depending on the thickness of the skin. Then I use a big rubber band (the sort offices use for holding files together) and secure that between the rim and the groove where the tacks go. I then tie strong string in the groove all the way round and secure it with a dowl so I can tighten or loosen as I wish. More elastic bands to hold the lot in place and then I leave it.
If it needs adjusting as it dried I upend the drum and pour water in until the skin is supple again and adjust the tension accordingly and rubber band it all up again. When you're happy with it and it's dry take off the rubber bands and string and the skin will stay in place. Tack in on and you're done.
I really would not use glue.
The smooth side of the skin goes on the outside, and the back of the goat can go where you want it to; top to bottom sounds about right to me.
# Posted on March 8th 2010 by Sugarfoot Jack
Re: Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
Sorry: It should read 1-2 inches.
# Posted on March 8th 2010 by Sugarfoot Jack
Re: Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
http://babyparenting.about.com/od/holidayactivities/ss/shamrockstencil.htm
# Posted on March 8th 2010 by llig leahcim
Re: Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
Have you thought of doing it in the bathroom, steaming it up before you start ? That should take care of the dry atmosphere.
I replaced my banjo head recently - it's not rocket science.
# Posted on March 8th 2010 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
Hi, Pete
Nice post! Do you have to do that naked too?!
# Posted on March 8th 2010 by Rob
Re: Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
I'm glad there isn't a camera on my computer !
Did you ever hear of the old lady who decided she would liven up proceedings at her old people's home by doing a streak, except she wasn't quite that fast.........?
"Did you see that, Elmer ?"
"Well, I don't know quite what it was, but whatever she was wearing hadn't been ironed ! ".
'Nuff said.
# Posted on March 9th 2010 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Help with replacing a Bodhran skin ???
Hey guys thanks for all the replies
Just a few things to bring up though as I'm a bit confused by the talk of a groove.
Now please keep in mind I don’t have much info to go on here as I don’t have anything like a wide knowledge of Bodhran construction or maybe I’m miss-understanding but just to point out, this frame does not have any kind of a groove to it.
In looking at it bare, on the top it is just as straight and smooth on the sides and under where the head is affixed as it is on the bottom half.
So there is no groove that might help in the process as I think it was described. I can see how that would work if it had a groove as that would add the resistance to shifting by rubbing against the groove but being smooth I think I may need something stronger to keep if from shifting around as I do the man handling of doing the tacking job.
Also as far as the gluing and I’m not trying to argue but really more to be educated but.
Previously, the tacks were spread apart by about 2-1/2 inches, there were 28 tacks for an 18” round drum.
Via the manufacturer I think as it was glued that this glue was doing the main holding and the tacks were more of a extra support as well as a way to keep the decorative strap in place.
Also to point out and I hope this doesn’t come off as cocky by as I was a rock drummer for about 20 years, as such I have changed and tuned my fair share of heads and as we all know there are typically not many lugs or fixed points of tension to a drum of this sort either, but that the key is the rim that is built into the head that makes that not much of big deal so in a sense this recreates a rather evenly attached head much like the glue method would one, if you get what I mean, which I wouldn’t get with skin such as I have now unless I used a lot of tacks.
At any rate I guess what I’m trying to say is that I kinda get why the manufacture used glue as if not, especially without a groove, you would have to add a lot of tacks much like I see in some of the high end drums or else your going get some uneven tones under tension with a 2-1/2 spread and also not as good of a attachment support too as don’t forget, these heads nor the one I bought are of very high quality. Heck I can say that I was even able to tear the old heads skin quite easy just by hand.
As well even if you did go with that many tack method, again without a groove, it could be very hard to get like 80 tacks installed without ending up with some shifting or uneven tension, unless you are very skilled at that.
Or maybe I should say I know it will be for me at least.
At any rate, I greatly appreciate all the input and there was much here that I will use but I think I might still go with the glue method an re-tack it as it was, and I think I might even just try Elmers wood glue as that does clean up pretty well.
My only concern is that I just hope that with the wet head it will still affix to the skin and cure eventually and I’m hoping that with the wide band strap and the method of letting it sit for a while in the way I described, this will happen.
Anyway thanks for all the help everyone.
# Posted on March 12th 2010 by RyanAir2112