Here's a question for you guys. I play a pretty standard repetoire of tunes, mostly learned by ear from the sessions I've gone to. However, I know a few tunes that I've nicked off some pretty obscure CDs, and the few times I've played them, I've been met with (understandable) silence.
One of these tunes in particular -- Gan Ainm (jig) -- is among my favorites, and I'd LOVE to spread it to other players.
In your opinion, what's the best way to get a session playing one of your favorite tunes?
If by the third time you play it no one has attempted to join in, or asked you to play through it a time or two a little slow so they can learn it, then you have either picked a dud tune or a dud session.
Shawaddy has it. Just be more open about it. Ask your mates if they like it. Be straight forward, there's no need for subterfuge. Play it then ask your mates if they think it's a worth while addition. If you've got good mates they'll tell you truth.
New tunes - don't play them so they seem like new tunes. Practise them relentlessly until you can just toss them into the mix, played at merciless speed, and then pretend that you thought everyone knew that one, and if not, why not!? Possibly do this in league with an accomplice.
You might also find it beneficial to express mild surprise that nobody remembers that it is the tune that [[<<insert name of someone famous but preferably dead from Irish Music tradition here>>]] said he remembered his grandaddy used to whistle while digging the potato patch / building the Titanic / emigrating.
That's me with the new tunes. Just look at the stuff I've submitted lately. I tried the accompice trick, but then I went and learned a bunch of new tunes while they weren't around. I usually manage once through with a straight face all by myself and then go on to something else or stop and say, so obviously nobody knows that one... I probably put a lot of obscure tunes out there so they are not surprised, but I pretend I wasn't aware. The problem is, many of those tunes I learned because they were such great tunes so I played the heck out of them by myself and they have become my some of my strongest tunes, so now I want to start them, and I'm back to trying to learn common repertoire by osmosis once again.
Showaddy, a "Fool" as in Shakespeare, perhaps? A Fool in mediaeval times was an educated person with a privileged position in the Court whose job it was to entertain and confidentially advise (and criticise) His Majesty, and generally act as a source of wisdom and knowledge.
lazyhound -
You speak the truth. The king's fool was just about the only person would could get away with (in confidentiality, of course) of criticizing the king. Interesting postion, the fool. I wonder, however, how many fools lost their heads because they took it too far or criticized publicly?
Learn the tunes you love. Play them at your session with all the passion you can muster and sod the consequences. In my experience people will whine and whinge wether you play them or don't play them. If you play them often enough and they are catchy enough they will pick them up eventually,or at least some will and some won't. In my opinion sessions need to have new tunes introduced regularly otherwise it's the same people playing the same tunes week in week out, year in year out, (and then you may lose the will to live) as it is with so many of the sessions I have been to. The trick is not to over do it.
If you introduce a new tune, and you are the only one playing it, you gotta ROCK it! People will respond to the quality of the playing even more than to the quality of the tune...and if you are playing it solo, you can't fake it. You gotta have it DIALED.
If it's a decent tune, and you play it awesomely, and nobody says "hey, what's that one called?", you have a dud session.
Around here, when people like what others' play, the write the tune names down and look 'em up and learn 'em, or they record them. We also pass written and recorded music around via email so we cna learn similar tunes.
At our IAANJ session we encourage that! We sort of loosely go around the circle...intend to anyway, sometimes it gets a bit out of order but no one minds if that happens a bit. So when it's someone's turn to kick one off, and they have a new tune, they just ask if they can play it. It;s always met with interest and curiosity, and people may record it.
Everyone seems to welcome this but the person presenting it will always say, play along if you know it, but generally they will say they will play it, and then they will follow with a set of reels or jigs all the others know, so everyone can join in. Pretty easy, keeps it interesting.
lazyhound's and JimmyB's description of the meaning of "Fool" are pretty much the same as the definition of "curmudgeon" which came up recently.
Oddly enough - some years back I chose to start my profile on this board with the line "I was the little boy who pointed out that the emperor was naked"
hmm.
Maybe it's true then, that the man who sows a character reaps a destiny.
When I first started learning, I would ask for the name of this tune which I’d heard, and then find those tunes and devour them.
Sometimes I was picking up 50+ tunes a week.
In a Sunday session at The Hare and Hounds in Liverpool in 1980, I played Mayor Harrison’s Fedora and a “senior” (English born) fiddle player leaned across and whipped me on the bridge of my nose with his bow, shouting “Why do you always have so many f*”+in’ new tunes?”
It was not a nice moment, let me tell you, and fortunately a lot of the people there urged him not to lose it, and said things like “He’s only hungry for the music”.
Still to this day I seek tunes, and if I lead a set of tunes here in Hobart, and nobody joins in I usually cut after once, maybe twice through, and go into what I think will be a common tune, to get everyone playing.
When you have a great lot of tunes it can be difficult though to keep a repertoire open and alive when playing in just one regular session.
Keep looking for lovely interesting tunes; you never know, you just might stimulate another’s interest!
I've found that if you want to introduce a tune and get people playing it, it's better not to follow it at all (where's the rule that says every tune has to be in a set anyway). If you follow an unfamiliar tune with an everyman set, no body will remember the tune you started with. It will just look like you wanted to play a tune on your own before everybody else joins in. Be up front, "here's one I just learned". Play it, stop, ask "what do you think? Worth persevering?"
The point is to get people interested in it, to actively try to remember it. To make the effort or tell you not to bother. Why waste time playing tunes no one's interested in? If you have a tune that only you like, the chances are it's a crap tune. If you still like it, play it on your own at home.
In my time I've learned plenty of tunes off records that I though were belters, only to discover later that they weren't very good after all. You listen to your favorite players/bands and be really taken with a track, but what often happens is that it's the arrangement, or even merely just the tune playing itself, that gets you. You put the effort in and learn the tune faithfully, take it to your mates and discover that it's not such the good tune you thought it was.
And it's no good saying, "but have you heard it such and such play it on their record, it's great?" A good tune's a good tune. It doesn't need such and such a player.
A perfect example is when I recently made the request for a tune title I had lost, The North Clare Jig (Stop Press! Brian forgets tune!)
When it just popped out everyone said “Wow! That’s the next one we want!”
So what llig has said alludes to exactly that situation. The tune will stand on its own and not because it is (hidden) in a set.
Hi Mix! Maybe your comment suggests “All around the world” paired with “The dogs amongst the bushes”!
Well Chrispy, I hope some of the suggestions offered here are of some use to you; the main thing is to enjoy your playing and to enjoy playing with others.
Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Here's a question for you guys. I play a pretty standard repetoire of tunes, mostly learned by ear from the sessions I've gone to. However, I know a few tunes that I've nicked off some pretty obscure CDs, and the few times I've played them, I've been met with (understandable) silence.
One of these tunes in particular -- Gan Ainm (jig) -- is among my favorites, and I'd LOVE to spread it to other players.
In your opinion, what's the best way to get a session playing one of your favorite tunes?
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by TheChrispy
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
blackmail
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by airport
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Play it again.
And again the next week.
If by the third time you play it no one has attempted to join in, or asked you to play through it a time or two a little slow so they can learn it, then you have either picked a dud tune or a dud session.
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by showaddydadito
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Shawaddy has it. Just be more open about it. Ask your mates if they like it. Be straight forward, there's no need for subterfuge. Play it then ask your mates if they think it's a worth while addition. If you've got good mates they'll tell you truth.
( It's the same if you've written a tune)
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by llig leahcim
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
"Gan Ainm (jig)" you say, Chrispy?
Now which particular "gan ainm" might that be, then?
Can you please post it (or post a link to it, if it's already here)?
Then all the online sessioners can chip in their two pennyworth and tell you if it's a good tune or not.
If the majority say "yes, it is" you can then perhaps conclude that there is something wrong with the bunch of musicians at your session ....
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by Mix O'Lydian
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Yeah, that would be fun. Let's see if the lowest common denominator can decide.
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by llig leahcim
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
. . . . that must be me, for I am sometimes called Fool.
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by showaddydadito
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
New tunes - don't play them so they seem like new tunes. Practise them relentlessly until you can just toss them into the mix, played at merciless speed, and then pretend that you thought everyone knew that one, and if not, why not!? Possibly do this in league with an accomplice.
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by RichardB
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
You might also find it beneficial to express mild surprise that nobody remembers that it is the tune that [[<<insert name of someone famous but preferably dead from Irish Music tradition here>>]] said he remembered his grandaddy used to whistle while digging the potato patch / building the Titanic / emigrating.
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by showaddydadito
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
That's me with the new tunes. Just look at the stuff I've submitted lately. I tried the accompice trick, but then I went and learned a bunch of new tunes while they weren't around. I usually manage once through with a straight face all by myself and then go on to something else or stop and say, so obviously nobody knows that one... I probably put a lot of obscure tunes out there so they are not surprised, but I pretend I wasn't aware. The problem is, many of those tunes I learned because they were such great tunes so I played the heck out of them by myself and they have become my some of my strongest tunes, so now I want to start them, and I'm back to trying to learn common repertoire by osmosis once again.
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by Earl Cameron
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Showaddy, a "Fool" as in Shakespeare, perhaps? A Fool in mediaeval times was an educated person with a privileged position in the Court whose job it was to entertain and confidentially advise (and criticise) His Majesty, and generally act as a source of wisdom and knowledge.
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Shakespeare was no fool. You think he changed the meaning?
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by llig leahcim
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
lazyhound -
You speak the truth. The king's fool was just about the only person would could get away with (in confidentiality, of course) of criticizing the king. Interesting postion, the fool. I wonder, however, how many fools lost their heads because they took it too far or criticized publicly?
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by Jimmy B
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
This being a fool sounds a good job . Where do I apply?
Years of experiance.
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by bazouki dave
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Bazouki Dave--you must apply to King Crimson (otherwise known as Robert Fripp) at The Court Of The Crimson King.
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by fauxcelt
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Learn the tunes you love. Play them at your session with all the passion you can muster and sod the consequences. In my experience people will whine and whinge wether you play them or don't play them. If you play them often enough and they are catchy enough they will pick them up eventually,or at least some will and some won't. In my opinion sessions need to have new tunes introduced regularly otherwise it's the same people playing the same tunes week in week out, year in year out, (and then you may lose the will to live) as it is with so many of the sessions I have been to. The trick is not to over do it.
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by Taurus
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
If you introduce a new tune, and you are the only one playing it, you gotta ROCK it! People will respond to the quality of the playing even more than to the quality of the tune...and if you are playing it solo, you can't fake it. You gotta have it DIALED.
If it's a decent tune, and you play it awesomely, and nobody says "hey, what's that one called?", you have a dud session.
Around here, when people like what others' play, the write the tune names down and look 'em up and learn 'em, or they record them. We also pass written and recorded music around via email so we cna learn similar tunes.
chris
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by chris stolz
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Bribery.
Threats of violence.
Keep playing the Butterfly till they submit.
# Posted on January 13th 2010 by Piece
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
At our IAANJ session we encourage that! We sort of loosely go around the circle...intend to anyway, sometimes it gets a bit out of order but no one minds if that happens a bit. So when it's someone's turn to kick one off, and they have a new tune, they just ask if they can play it. It;s always met with interest and curiosity, and people may record it.
Everyone seems to welcome this but the person presenting it will always say, play along if you know it, but generally they will say they will play it, and then they will follow with a set of reels or jigs all the others know, so everyone can join in. Pretty easy, keeps it interesting.
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by irisnevins
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
hmm . . .
lazyhound's and JimmyB's description of the meaning of "Fool" are pretty much the same as the definition of "curmudgeon" which came up recently.
Oddly enough - some years back I chose to start my profile on this board with the line "I was the little boy who pointed out that the emperor was naked"
hmm.
Maybe it's true then, that the man who sows a character reaps a destiny.
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by showaddydadito
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
I wish I played Irish music too.
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by showaddydadito
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Hi there! Hope all's well with you.
I agree with llig; Showad got it spot on.
When I first started learning, I would ask for the name of this tune which I’d heard, and then find those tunes and devour them.
Sometimes I was picking up 50+ tunes a week.
In a Sunday session at The Hare and Hounds in Liverpool in 1980, I played Mayor Harrison’s Fedora and a “senior” (English born) fiddle player leaned across and whipped me on the bridge of my nose with his bow, shouting “Why do you always have so many f*”+in’ new tunes?”
It was not a nice moment, let me tell you, and fortunately a lot of the people there urged him not to lose it, and said things like “He’s only hungry for the music”.
Still to this day I seek tunes, and if I lead a set of tunes here in Hobart, and nobody joins in I usually cut after once, maybe twice through, and go into what I think will be a common tune, to get everyone playing.
When you have a great lot of tunes it can be difficult though to keep a repertoire open and alive when playing in just one regular session.
Keep looking for lovely interesting tunes; you never know, you just might stimulate another’s interest!
All the best and happy playing
Brian x
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by briantheflute
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
I frequently play sets where I'll go from a new tune no one knows to an "everybody" tune. If people like a tune, they'll eventually pick it up.
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
I've found that if you want to introduce a tune and get people playing it, it's better not to follow it at all (where's the rule that says every tune has to be in a set anyway). If you follow an unfamiliar tune with an everyman set, no body will remember the tune you started with. It will just look like you wanted to play a tune on your own before everybody else joins in. Be up front, "here's one I just learned". Play it, stop, ask "what do you think? Worth persevering?"
The point is to get people interested in it, to actively try to remember it. To make the effort or tell you not to bother. Why waste time playing tunes no one's interested in? If you have a tune that only you like, the chances are it's a crap tune. If you still like it, play it on your own at home.
In my time I've learned plenty of tunes off records that I though were belters, only to discover later that they weren't very good after all. You listen to your favorite players/bands and be really taken with a track, but what often happens is that it's the arrangement, or even merely just the tune playing itself, that gets you. You put the effort in and learn the tune faithfully, take it to your mates and discover that it's not such the good tune you thought it was.
And it's no good saying, "but have you heard it such and such play it on their record, it's great?" A good tune's a good tune. It doesn't need such and such a player.
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by llig leahcim
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Well put Llig.
Don't hide a new tune behind other tunes.
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by showaddydadito
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Well, Chrispy - we're still all waiting for you to submit that jig that you think the world and his dog ought to be playing ...
Let's be having it, please !
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by Mix O'Lydian
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Aye, come on ...
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by llig leahcim
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
... note that I said "the world and his dog" ...
... maybe lazyhound would like to play it ...
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by Mix O'Lydian
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
maybe this is it?
http://www.thesession.org/tunes/display/10044
;)
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by mandolinist
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Okay, okay, I will never hide a new tune behind common tunes again.
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Can't be, mandolinist -that one's not a jig
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by Mix O'Lydian
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Print out some sheet music for your tune and just hand it to them.
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by Gringo
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
http://www.thesession.org/tunes/display/9822
is that it then??????
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by mandolinist
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Again well put llig!
A perfect example is when I recently made the request for a tune title I had lost, The North Clare Jig (Stop Press! Brian forgets tune!)
When it just popped out everyone said “Wow! That’s the next one we want!”
So what llig has said alludes to exactly that situation. The tune will stand on its own and not because it is (hidden) in a set.
Hi Mix! Maybe your comment suggests “All around the world” paired with “The dogs amongst the bushes”!
Well Chrispy, I hope some of the suggestions offered here are of some use to you; the main thing is to enjoy your playing and to enjoy playing with others.
Best wishes
Brian x
# Posted on January 14th 2010 by briantheflute
Re: Eitiquette of introducing new tunes
Be a little patient. I can't find the bloody tune anywhere on the internet, so looks like I'll have to record the thing mysef.
# Posted on January 15th 2010 by TheChrispy