Is there a recommended technique for playing tremolo on a guitar using a pick? At what angle to the string should the pick be held for tremolo? (I'm trying to learn how to do this after encountering tremolo requirements for the first time in tablature. I don't usually use a pick.) Thanks.
As you hint, tremolo on guitar is more usually associated with finger-style playing (as in 'Recuerdos de L'Alhambra'|), though sometimes used by plectrum-toting gypsy guitarists, so I would look there for youtube examples, 'cos there may be some about. The main trick with any plectrum tremolo is steady, even, up-down picking, starting out slow for practiceand then building speed as you progress. You want to keep an ear open for tone, 'cos you don't want it too thin. As for pick angle, I wouldn't worry too much. Best to stay relaxed and work from the wrist, in my view, as a mandolinist - but I have heard good tremolo from elbow-drivers. Experiment, and keep your ears open. And bear in mind: good taste. Tremolo aint always appropriate.
What do we mean by tremolo here? - I'm guessing that we are talking about didlidldlidlidlidlidlidl and not wawawawawawawawawaaaaaa, but I'd really like to know.
(I just noticed that "Tremolo aint always appropriate" is only a step away from "Tremolo always aint appropriate".)
Please, gentlemen, earnestness at all times whilst addressing all matters.
The thumbnail, sprung deep from the bone, provides all the tremolo needed to satisfy even the most stringent tab requirements. Buttermilk encourages its growth. File its edge to a precise arc. Name it, polish it.
I play Mandolin, so it is slightly different, but not much.
The only tricks to learning a good tremolo I know are relaxing, not tensing up, the muscles in your arm, and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of practice. It is a long slow process and, as you may have noticed from some of the above responses, it is not necessarily accepted in many Irish Sessions. This doesn't mean that it isn't worth the effort, but use it tastefully and try to gauge the reaction of the people you are playing with.
Arlo
If you must… You’ll get a smoother sound if you angle the plectrum more than you would ever do in normal playing. You’ll probably need a fairly heavy gauge pick. For a plectrum tremolo to have any chance of being useful on the guitar, it really needs to be pretty fast – faster than a mandolin tremolo. Not everyone can do this and I’m not sure if it’s trainable. Or worth the effort. It's more of a novelty than a satisfying musical technique.
Another guitar player at thesession.org. Someone should award his bravery for speaking out.
For dance tunes you should only need two or three quick notes in place of a roll, like a mandolin player or zouk player would do. I find that fiddle and accordion ornaments on guitars/zouks/mandolins are difficult if not impossible to play with any fluidity. They don't carry well from one system to the other and so I substitute short tremolo bursts or double-picked notes.
If that's what you're trying to do then it's a matter of practice and experimentation. Don't worry yourself with angle of attack, because it's not like you're going to measure it before dropping into the ornament. You're just going to employ it naturally as it is required in the tune. Loosening up is very good advice because tense muscles in arms and hands will cause you to trip. Play closer to the bridge but not too close, try halfway between sound hole and bridge, where your hand wants to play anyway. Experiment with pick and string gauges until it's more comfortable to accomplish at a slower tempo (say, 3/4 of the intended tempo) then run with it. For that sort of thing I play with light gauge Dunlop Tortex picks because other materials tend to click too much. I have experimented by filing one edge of the profile down so it is sharp and leaving the other beveled as it came.
To practice the basic mechanics, repeat the phrase or other phrases which require the tremolo, and listen while you do it. Understand how it is supposed to sound and then work up your speed until you can do it correctly. Then do this enough times, make the ornament a part of how you play tunes, and it will be a natural thing you do whenever you feel like it.
I built two "Appalachian school" "box" instruments. I've installed five strings tuned in fifths, and am using mandolin tablature in my effort to learn to play them, hence the tremolo requirements. I've substituted vibrato in the same places that tremolo is indicated in the mandolin tablature, and find it more suited to my limited skills, altough there are one or two places where double strings are paired with long notes in some carols that permit the instrument to produce more of a mandolin-like effect with tremolo. The plectrum is intended to provide more volume with the silk and steel string sets I assembled from some special order nylon wound and plain steel strings to produce more of the "bluegrass" tone for which this overall design was intended. (I constructed two teardrop shaped instruments using purely nylon strings in fifths for music to which I don't want to lend a bluegrass/country edge, like ITM and classical works.)
sounds like a pretty interesting project, actually, Arthur
so I feel ashamed for not giving a more earnest answer earlier. Pure Drops is right. So here goes...
I use tremolo sometimes with my jazz trio when there is a long note in the melody and the sustain you can get with a horn is the sound I really need.
The idea is that you want the effect to be musically the same as a long sustained note, which is impossible to play on a fretted string instrument
so the most important thing in the picking is not to move very far. Whatever angle you are comfortable with (and I find that pick angle can be used to create and enhance the effect, so experiment for yourself) you just don't want to move far from the string
I do not reccomend practicing this slow
I would practice playing whole note durations, moving up and down one string, then I would practice crosing over to another string, then I would take a song melody and use tremolo on all of the notes longer than a quarter note, so as to learn to employ it melodically and musically
then I would forget it all and only play it only once in a while as a special effect or unusual texture to mix things up
I could almost see it used on a lower D note to simulate a drone for a section, then switch back to chords on the next part of the tune or something
we build simple homemade string instruments here in Appalachia. they are alot simpler to make than a guitar or mandolin, so pretty much anybody with a workshop can turn them out. I have a friend up in town who was making "box guitars" to take along camping.
I'm just guessing that is what he is making. Its what I took it to be anyway. Not uncommon around here at all
There's a guy on youtube who makes banjos out of oil cans and broom handles. Jim Eldon in Hull UK showed me a 'fiddle' he'd made out of a plastic milk carton (about 4 pints). By the way, is that it for tremolo advice then? Good luck with it all Arthur.
Mr. Ryan is quite correct with regard to my reference to the "Appalachian school" of guitar design. I presently have two, partially constructed cigar box ukuleles awaiting spare time and motivation in the workshop inspired by that Depression Era school of instrument design. They were intended as Christmas presents. (Fingers crossed.)
When I build "a box" I refer to the Appalachian school of design to give credit were credit is due. The teardrop instruments are modeled more after traditional, guitar construction techniques from the Spanish school. The early romantic era guitar project that I completed borrowed from the Spanish school but took on its own character due to the long body of the resonant chamber modeled after some late Renaissance early Romantic Era guitars.
Thank you for your insights. I'll try to play it close to the strings. (My interest in tremolo is largely to produce more of a manodlin-like effect on the longest notes.)
Tremolo
Tremolo
Is there a recommended technique for playing tremolo on a guitar using a pick? At what angle to the string should the pick be held for tremolo? (I'm trying to learn how to do this after encountering tremolo requirements for the first time in tablature. I don't usually use a pick.) Thanks.
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by Arthur Nordstrom
Re: Tremolo
Hmm, lovely. slow airs on the guitar from tab with tremelo
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Tremolo
As you hint, tremolo on guitar is more usually associated with finger-style playing (as in 'Recuerdos de L'Alhambra'|), though sometimes used by plectrum-toting gypsy guitarists, so I would look there for youtube examples, 'cos there may be some about. The main trick with any plectrum tremolo is steady, even, up-down picking, starting out slow for practiceand then building speed as you progress. You want to keep an ear open for tone, 'cos you don't want it too thin. As for pick angle, I wouldn't worry too much. Best to stay relaxed and work from the wrist, in my view, as a mandolinist - but I have heard good tremolo from elbow-drivers. Experiment, and keep your ears open. And bear in mind: good taste. Tremolo aint always appropriate.
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by Jim Younger
Re: Tremolo
stop it, llig!......<snicker,snicker,snicker>
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by Nate Ryan
Re: Tremolo
What do we mean by tremolo here? - I'm guessing that we are talking about didlidldlidlidlidlidlidl and not wawawawawawawawawaaaaaa, but I'd really like to know.
(I just noticed that "Tremolo aint always appropriate" is only a step away from "Tremolo always aint appropriate".)
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by showaddydadito
Re: Tremolo
Please, gentlemen, earnestness at all times whilst addressing all matters.
The thumbnail, sprung deep from the bone, provides all the tremolo needed to satisfy even the most stringent tab requirements. Buttermilk encourages its growth. File its edge to a precise arc. Name it, polish it.
Unleash it.
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by NEW Pure Drop® Ear Canal Oil
Re: Tremolo
I play Mandolin, so it is slightly different, but not much.
The only tricks to learning a good tremolo I know are relaxing, not tensing up, the muscles in your arm, and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of practice. It is a long slow process and, as you may have noticed from some of the above responses, it is not necessarily accepted in many Irish Sessions. This doesn't mean that it isn't worth the effort, but use it tastefully and try to gauge the reaction of the people you are playing with.
Arlo
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by Nopstavon
Re: Tremolo
I like to borrow a mando (if there's one at the session) and rip into this with full on tremolo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkTQdEZbjQA
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Tremolo
If you must… You’ll get a smoother sound if you angle the plectrum more than you would ever do in normal playing. You’ll probably need a fairly heavy gauge pick. For a plectrum tremolo to have any chance of being useful on the guitar, it really needs to be pretty fast – faster than a mandolin tremolo. Not everyone can do this and I’m not sure if it’s trainable. Or worth the effort. It's more of a novelty than a satisfying musical technique.
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by Bob himself
Re: Tremolo
Classic tremolo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLHR8zaEsA8
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by Ramiro
Re: Tremolo
Yepes cheats; he requires a 10 string guitar to do that...
# Posted on November 19th 2009 by Rick Payman
Re: Tremolo
Trads need not apply...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wYytZEzdDY&feature=related
# Posted on November 19th 2009 by Rick Payman
Re: Tremolo
Another guitar player at thesession.org. Someone should award his bravery for speaking out.
For dance tunes you should only need two or three quick notes in place of a roll, like a mandolin player or zouk player would do. I find that fiddle and accordion ornaments on guitars/zouks/mandolins are difficult if not impossible to play with any fluidity. They don't carry well from one system to the other and so I substitute short tremolo bursts or double-picked notes.
If that's what you're trying to do then it's a matter of practice and experimentation. Don't worry yourself with angle of attack, because it's not like you're going to measure it before dropping into the ornament. You're just going to employ it naturally as it is required in the tune. Loosening up is very good advice because tense muscles in arms and hands will cause you to trip. Play closer to the bridge but not too close, try halfway between sound hole and bridge, where your hand wants to play anyway. Experiment with pick and string gauges until it's more comfortable to accomplish at a slower tempo (say, 3/4 of the intended tempo) then run with it. For that sort of thing I play with light gauge Dunlop Tortex picks because other materials tend to click too much. I have experimented by filing one edge of the profile down so it is sharp and leaving the other beveled as it came.
To practice the basic mechanics, repeat the phrase or other phrases which require the tremolo, and listen while you do it. Understand how it is supposed to sound and then work up your speed until you can do it correctly. Then do this enough times, make the ornament a part of how you play tunes, and it will be a natural thing you do whenever you feel like it.
# Posted on November 19th 2009 by gravelwalks
Re: Tremolo
Thank you all.
I built two "Appalachian school" "box" instruments. I've installed five strings tuned in fifths, and am using mandolin tablature in my effort to learn to play them, hence the tremolo requirements. I've substituted vibrato in the same places that tremolo is indicated in the mandolin tablature, and find it more suited to my limited skills, altough there are one or two places where double strings are paired with long notes in some carols that permit the instrument to produce more of a mandolin-like effect with tremolo. The plectrum is intended to provide more volume with the silk and steel string sets I assembled from some special order nylon wound and plain steel strings to produce more of the "bluegrass" tone for which this overall design was intended. (I constructed two teardrop shaped instruments using purely nylon strings in fifths for music to which I don't want to lend a bluegrass/country edge, like ITM and classical works.)
# Posted on November 19th 2009 by Arthur Nordstrom
Re: Tremolo
sounds like a pretty interesting project, actually, Arthur
so I feel ashamed for not giving a more earnest answer earlier. Pure Drops is right. So here goes...
I use tremolo sometimes with my jazz trio when there is a long note in the melody and the sustain you can get with a horn is the sound I really need.
The idea is that you want the effect to be musically the same as a long sustained note, which is impossible to play on a fretted string instrument
so the most important thing in the picking is not to move very far. Whatever angle you are comfortable with (and I find that pick angle can be used to create and enhance the effect, so experiment for yourself) you just don't want to move far from the string
I do not reccomend practicing this slow
I would practice playing whole note durations, moving up and down one string, then I would practice crosing over to another string, then I would take a song melody and use tremolo on all of the notes longer than a quarter note, so as to learn to employ it melodically and musically
then I would forget it all and only play it only once in a while as a special effect or unusual texture to mix things up
I could almost see it used on a lower D note to simulate a drone for a section, then switch back to chords on the next part of the tune or something
anyway, good luck with the boxes Arthur
# Posted on November 19th 2009 by Nate Ryan
Re: Tremolo
Ummm, Arthur, what is an "Appalachian school" "box" instrument?
# Posted on November 19th 2009 by Bob himself
Re: Tremolo
we build simple homemade string instruments here in Appalachia. they are alot simpler to make than a guitar or mandolin, so pretty much anybody with a workshop can turn them out. I have a friend up in town who was making "box guitars" to take along camping.
I'm just guessing that is what he is making. Its what I took it to be anyway. Not uncommon around here at all
# Posted on November 19th 2009 by Nate Ryan
Re: Tremolo
I just never heard box instruments called "Appalachian school." I'm an Appalachian critter, myself.
# Posted on November 19th 2009 by Bob himself
Re: Tremolo
There's a guy on youtube who makes banjos out of oil cans and broom handles. Jim Eldon in Hull UK showed me a 'fiddle' he'd made out of a plastic milk carton (about 4 pints). By the way, is that it for tremolo advice then? Good luck with it all Arthur.
# Posted on November 19th 2009 by Jim Younger
Re: Tremolo
Mr. Ryan is quite correct with regard to my reference to the "Appalachian school" of guitar design. I presently have two, partially constructed cigar box ukuleles awaiting spare time and motivation in the workshop inspired by that Depression Era school of instrument design. They were intended as Christmas presents. (Fingers crossed.)
When I build "a box" I refer to the Appalachian school of design to give credit were credit is due. The teardrop instruments are modeled more after traditional, guitar construction techniques from the Spanish school. The early romantic era guitar project that I completed borrowed from the Spanish school but took on its own character due to the long body of the resonant chamber modeled after some late Renaissance early Romantic Era guitars.
Thank you for your insights. I'll try to play it close to the strings. (My interest in tremolo is largely to produce more of a manodlin-like effect on the longest notes.)
Thank you for the insights.
# Posted on November 20th 2009 by Arthur Nordstrom
Re: Tremolo
Dont put the plectrum to deep in the string, you really just need to rub the tip on the strings just to tickle it.
# Posted on November 23rd 2009 by tirvaluk