my kids are invovled in set dancing. They also play Irish trad music (fiddles, whistles and flute). I know that many of hte kids that they dance with also play ITM.
On the other hand, anybody I know involved in Irish step dancing (the Lord of the Dance / silly costumes / silly hairdos stuff, ) do not play any irish music.
Is this just me or has anybody else noticed?
My children play fiddle and whistle and go Irish step dancing, but to a teacher who knows how I feel about Riverdance/ hairdos/ fluorescent costumes. They learn to dance not only individual reels, jigs etc. but also 4-hand and 8-hands which I would call ceili dances - Sweets of May, High Cauled Cap etc. I suppose I'm lucky we have several dance schools in Coventry (UK) to choose from. Mary, their dance teacher, also plays accordion, so they really seem to get the best of both worlds.
It's because in Irish step the hands are so neglected your arm and hand muscles fall into atrophy and you're only able to play harmonica, if fixed to your shoulders. I distinctly remember it has been scientifically proven somewhere, I just can't find the link.
EastPole - to avoid loss of function they exercise by using one of them little traditional irish hand drums thingy doodahs - you know the thing I mean - Bodkan or something like that they call them.
When I was a kid a Bodcan was a large tin of four pints of Boddingtons. (empty, they sounded quite good too - or maybe that was because you'd emptied it down your neck)
Set and ceilidhe dancers like live music more than the step dancers, especially those who dance competitively, they often prefer a boom box to real musicians. A real shame. But we also have some teachers around that teach non-competitive dance, just for the fun of it, and encourage their step dancers to seek out live music. So all is not lost in the step dance world!
I've found the set dancers a lot more appreciative, more of a communal experience. I think the step dance, by its nature, is more of a performance situation, as opposed to a party feel with set dancers, a ceili is, in its original meaning, a social gathering.
I play fiddle and I Irish Step dance. A number of the young-uns also are getting into playing the music. I don't understand the orginal post at all. Seems it is based soley on prejudice and stereotypes. I don't know anyone in our school of dance that wears glittery costumes or has been in riverdance.
On another note, the people that performed in Riverdance are talented. How many of you could seriously do one eight count?!
What's even harder: trying to dance and play fiddle at the same time... the old rubbing the tummy and tappin the head syndrome!
Most of the tunes you'll hear at a session are associated with the step dancing side of the dance floor, So i don't see how you could be right Banjobongo, but maybe it's different in Limerick. I know several step dancers who play very well indeed! (silly costumes/ hairdos notwithstanding)
I play a lot more (IT) music since i started step dancing because I learn the dances by humming a tune. By the time I've learned the dance I've got the correct tune too. Not all dancers learn by this method and some even say they can't hum and dance at the same time. Once you have the rhythm pattern of a particular dance in your body, you can do it to other tunes of the same type, of course. Then, strictly speaking you don't need the music any more. But hopefully you want it! I would say, as I've written here before, that playing and dancing complement eachother. But yes, it's true, you don't come across many dancers doing both, as practice time is doubled, for one.
As for Set dance versus Step: Step dancers are taught the group dances from the ceili collection Ar Rince Fóirne, Thirty Popular Céili Dances. They aren't really comparable to Set Dances except for the use of reel, jig and hornpipe music and the fact that many of them are for four couples in square formation. The ceili dances use a few basic steps whereas the set dances each have their own sean-nós type of batter. And the Ar rince foirne ceili dances don't have the swing and fewer 'house arounds'.
What I see is crossing styles - sean-nos dancers using a very natural dance style next to dancers clearly trained in the step tradition of the dancing masters: straight arms, ramrod bodies and "10 to 2" toe turn-out.
I mean by "crossing styles" that there isn't a distinct boundary for the dance style "sean nos", and step dancers sometimes prefer an old time musician on fiddle, flute or even uillean pipe.
Step dancers tend to train for the next competition and therefore focus on the music or music band they're expected to be able to dance to.
Set dancing vs Irish dancing
Set dancing vs Irish dancing
my kids are invovled in set dancing. They also play Irish trad music (fiddles, whistles and flute). I know that many of hte kids that they dance with also play ITM.
On the other hand, anybody I know involved in Irish step dancing (the Lord of the Dance / silly costumes / silly hairdos stuff, ) do not play any irish music.
Is this just me or has anybody else noticed?
# Posted on October 29th 2009 by BanjoBongo
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
Michael Fatly playes the flute? almost?
# Posted on October 29th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
Well it's out now isn't it. They'll not be able to keep that secret any more.
# Posted on October 29th 2009 by showaddydadito
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
My children play fiddle and whistle and go Irish step dancing, but to a teacher who knows how I feel about Riverdance/ hairdos/ fluorescent costumes. They learn to dance not only individual reels, jigs etc. but also 4-hand and 8-hands which I would call ceili dances - Sweets of May, High Cauled Cap etc. I suppose I'm lucky we have several dance schools in Coventry (UK) to choose from. Mary, their dance teacher, also plays accordion, so they really seem to get the best of both worlds.
# Posted on October 29th 2009 by FiddleFi
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
It's because in Irish step the hands are so neglected your arm and hand muscles fall into atrophy and you're only able to play harmonica, if fixed to your shoulders. I distinctly remember it has been scientifically proven somewhere, I just can't find the link.
# Posted on October 29th 2009 by Janek
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
EastPole - to avoid loss of function they exercise by using one of them little traditional irish hand drums thingy doodahs - you know the thing I mean - Bodkan or something like that they call them.
# Posted on October 29th 2009 by showaddydadito
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
You mean the traditional Irish tambourine?
# Posted on October 29th 2009 by Janek
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
When I was a kid a Bodcan was a large tin of four pints of Boddingtons. (empty, they sounded quite good too - or maybe that was because you'd emptied it down your neck)
# Posted on October 29th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
and who could forget the Watneys party Seven?
# Posted on October 29th 2009 by showaddydadito
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
yeah we play tambourines in our session, really awesome dude! it complements the five string banjo and wash board!
# Posted on October 30th 2009 by fiddly dee fiddly doo oh how all take it so seriously!
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
Set and ceilidhe dancers like live music more than the step dancers, especially those who dance competitively, they often prefer a boom box to real musicians. A real shame. But we also have some teachers around that teach non-competitive dance, just for the fun of it, and encourage their step dancers to seek out live music. So all is not lost in the step dance world!
# Posted on October 30th 2009 by AlBrown
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
I've found the set dancers a lot more appreciative, more of a communal experience. I think the step dance, by its nature, is more of a performance situation, as opposed to a party feel with set dancers, a ceili is, in its original meaning, a social gathering.
# Posted on October 30th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
I play fiddle and I Irish Step dance. A number of the young-uns also are getting into playing the music. I don't understand the orginal post at all. Seems it is based soley on prejudice and stereotypes. I don't know anyone in our school of dance that wears glittery costumes or has been in riverdance.
On another note, the people that performed in Riverdance are talented. How many of you could seriously do one eight count?!
What's even harder: trying to dance and play fiddle at the same time... the old rubbing the tummy and tappin the head syndrome!
# Posted on October 30th 2009 by Fiddlechick7
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
Most of the tunes you'll hear at a session are associated with the step dancing side of the dance floor, So i don't see how you could be right Banjobongo, but maybe it's different in Limerick. I know several step dancers who play very well indeed! (silly costumes/ hairdos notwithstanding)
# Posted on October 31st 2009 by Backer
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
Part of the contest here is between dancing as a contest & dancing without the contest. Ironic.
# Posted on October 31st 2009 by Ben Steen
we could compare the burnout rate. ;)
# Posted on October 31st 2009 by Ben Steen
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
The origins of the different dance metres
Caoimhín Mac Aoidh
http://www.standingstones.com/cmaoitm.html#dancorg
# Posted on November 1st 2009 by Ben Steen
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
I play a lot more (IT) music since i started step dancing because I learn the dances by humming a tune. By the time I've learned the dance I've got the correct tune too. Not all dancers learn by this method and some even say they can't hum and dance at the same time. Once you have the rhythm pattern of a particular dance in your body, you can do it to other tunes of the same type, of course. Then, strictly speaking you don't need the music any more. But hopefully you want it! I would say, as I've written here before, that playing and dancing complement eachother. But yes, it's true, you don't come across many dancers doing both, as practice time is doubled, for one.
As for Set dance versus Step: Step dancers are taught the group dances from the ceili collection Ar Rince Fóirne, Thirty Popular Céili Dances. They aren't really comparable to Set Dances except for the use of reel, jig and hornpipe music and the fact that many of them are for four couples in square formation. The ceili dances use a few basic steps whereas the set dances each have their own sean-nós type of batter. And the Ar rince foirne ceili dances don't have the swing and fewer 'house arounds'.
What I see is crossing styles - sean-nos dancers using a very natural dance style next to dancers clearly trained in the step tradition of the dancing masters: straight arms, ramrod bodies and "10 to 2" toe turn-out.
C. Nicolas
# Posted on November 2nd 2009 by C. Nicolas
Re: Set dancing vs Irish dancing
I mean by "crossing styles" that there isn't a distinct boundary for the dance style "sean nos", and step dancers sometimes prefer an old time musician on fiddle, flute or even uillean pipe.
Step dancers tend to train for the next competition and therefore focus on the music or music band they're expected to be able to dance to.
C. Nicolas
# Posted on November 2nd 2009 by C. Nicolas