I was playing in the tin whistle competition of the ulster fleadh recently. when i got the ajudication sheet back, it said that i should get a better whistle. i was playing a Eb generation whistle. also, i am often told that generation whistles are not that good.
Could someone please recommend a better type of whistle?
"Many great players used a generation whistle, although not often in Eb, but usually in D."
I don't know what he rules are in a fleadh ceoil, but if you're playing on your own, it doesn't really matter what key your whistle's in. A lot of players *do* use Eb whistles on recordings and in performances. But in general, for session playing, you 'll need a D whistle.
Generation whistles can be great if you're lucky. But there are also a lot of dud ones, that sound squeaky or out of tune. Whatever whistle you buy, however cheap or expensive, you need to try *every single one* (not just each *type* - no two are exactly the same) before you make a decision. Many shops are reluctant to allow this nowadays, because of health and safety regulations. But they only need have a box of antiseptic wipes on hand to prevent the passing on of germs.
It is no doubt true to an extent that you get what you pay for - you can expect a better whistle for £120 than you'll get for £4. But in my experience, price and quality are not proportional - a John Sindt high D, for example, at £120, is better, but not 30 times better that the equivalent Generation whistle, at around £4. What you do get, I think, higher up the price range, is more consistency of quality - in fact, Generation whistles in particular are notorious for their inconsistency.
Get a rose whistle, honest to god they're the best, killian 'brien whistles are inconsistant, they're 190 sterling and are made from african blackwood, they're not good for a session because the tone is so soft and sweet and the high notes sound great too, I got my mine in an electric guitar shop in waterford for nothing! Get a sindt if you can't get the rose but hey Ive two munster fleadh medals playing slow airs on it and I honestly believe thats down to the quality of the whistle
Don't necessarily accept that the adjudicator was right. There might be nothing wrong with the Eb Generation at all. You were presumably happy enough with it up until then. I wouldn't change an instrument just to please some Comhaltas adjudicator. Did he/she suggest what might be a better instrument ?
I play a session Burke in D , and I think its brilliant . I have on order a Fred Rose african blackwood however I ordered it in March and am still waiting.
I agree not to put everything on one adjudicator's opinion. Do you have any whistle/flute playing friends you respect? Let them play your whistle and see what they think. Paddy Maloney, Mary Bergin and others played some "OK" music on gen's for years.
That said, Burkes, Roses, Sindts and other are great sounding whistles. Sean Ryan sounds grand on a Susato (a whistle that only costs $30).
Personally, I love the sound of the DIxon trad (about $24) and Jerry Freeman's tweaked Blackbird and MellowDog whisltes ($36).
You have a lot of choices in a lot of price ranges. A really good whistle will not make you a better player unless your current whistle really does suck. So much of a whistles overall sound comes from you, the player.
I think ragaman has the sense of it. When your score card came back and said that you should get a better whistle, It didn't mean get a better make of whistle. It merely meant get a better whistle. The vast majority of Generations are dreadful. But there are gems.
The Overton (lost a few years ago when a bag was stolen)was great if a little loud, the Burke (lost froma bag a couple of weeks ago) was beautiful. the Susato is ok, loud enough for the session but not as sweet or clear as the Burke.
The Willie Simmonds that a very kind friend has loaned me is fabulous but maybe a little quiet for a noisy session ( he does make louder ones though)
The Generations now are pretty dire unless you're very lucky, or clever enough to tweak them which I am not. Perhaps I should go into a shop and buy one, play it there for a while and if it's rubbish exchange it, repeating the procedure until I either find a decent one or they run out of stock. Gen might take their quality more seriously if all the bad ones got returned. What do you think?
I've had some nice whistles that were easy on the ears and hard on the wallet but the *best* whistle I ever had was an early 80s (late 70s?) model of a Feadóg. It's not the kind they're making today apparently. It had an angular head and a a really sweet sound right up into the third octave.
Echo all of the above.. when it comes down to it, the difference between bulk whistle makers (like Generation) and artisan whistle makers is the level of consistent quality (and reaction to any problems you have). You can get a quality whistle from a low end maker, but it may take some finding.
Don't even joke about it Duijera Dubh it's not a laughing matter I'm still reeling (pardon the pun) from the loss of that Burke!
The Happy Birthday from Joe Cocker did make me laugh though thanks for the link Although I'll never be able to listen to it again without giggling! Oh dear.
No, it isn't a laughing matter. I'd think about carrying two bags, one as a decoy.
Yes, the Cocker link was a serious laughing matter. I don't know if that link is there anymore. Here's another then. It's a classic isn't it?! Joe Cocker was a national hero in these parts back then. A good part of the teenage population at the time used to strive to look and sound like that - some of them still do I would think: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpjNLjBbVd4
You can't go far wrong with a Dixon Trad in brass for £15 from bigwhistle dot co dot uk. No shrillness or buzzing on any note and easy to play. Similar breath requirements as a Gen, well balanced between the notes.
Quite recently i went out to by a set of cheap whistles in all different keys, the majority of which ended up being Generation whistles. they have quality control issues - quality varied vastly not only between whistles of the same keys but from key-to-key. the Eb whistles all had one thing in common - they sucked! i went through almost the entire store's stock before i found one that was just about passable and even then it is the most raspy whistle i ever had, so my consensus is that the Eb generations are not the bestest whistles ever...
...i found a gorgeous sweet little F though and the Bb is generally really nice. for a decent D i'd definitely recommed Dixon although susato have a nice one too.
I have a number of Clarke's Sweetones, all from same shop, and all sound great and blow easily and feel right. A good whistle for a little outlay - about a fiver. You can then have them keep them in the car, in your bag, in the shed......!
Comhaltas adjudicators now habitually return 'get a better whistle' whenever a cheap (looking) whistle is being played irrespective of how well it sounds. I have seen some really really lovely sounding players (playing very nice Cillian O Briain improved whistles) get that advice and several people present at the competition were wondering if the adjudicator had actually listened to to the sounds played before him.
In some Scottish fiddle and accordion competitions the judges are behind a screen so they can't see who the performer is, let alone what instrument they're using. Doesn't Comhaltas ever do that?
I have a handful of Generation whistles. Not one of them plays as good or sounds as good as my Jerry Freeman Mellow Dog (which has a green head, making it my green whistle ).
This is especially true if you need to play a oxx ooo (C natural), which is always out of tune by a fair margin on a gen.
Competition is about raising standards. It don't really matter how many legendary performers have played Generation whistles in the past. What matters is what you can do to improve your performance next time -- since tone and tuning are part of the contest, the judge is telling you something you can do to improve. Take it or leave it, but it is what it is.
It can be, but often it isn't. The cases I mentioned of the Cillian O Briain whistles being played would not have been improved by changing to a Sindt for example. It would have been different, but it would not have been an improvement. The adjudicator was taking his clues from the visual, seeing a green plastic head, not from listening to the actual whistle being played. And I was not the only one thinking that either.
It's the same thing as the concertina competitions, the loveliest top of the range Crabb won't do, competitors need to be seen playing a Jeffries, even if it's a very mediocre one murdered by poor restoration.
The only way you can know what the adjudicator was thinking is if he was you. It would be interesting to hear from the adjudicators what they think they are hearing -- and to see if they still hear it behind a screen.
Regardless, being out of tune can always be improved on. None of my Generation whistles is tuned very well. And that's with the head in the optimal position. Most of them shipped with the head jammed on too far and were even worse to begin with.
Yep the old Feadogs from the 80 did me f'rom '84 to 2011 with the odd susato every now and thewn for volume.
. Now I use an Olivier Bouchard Whistle, which funnily enough was also the favourite choice at our little pipers club Ive just returned from . Class whistle IMO
Burkes are good, no doubt I have 2 low G's, one brass one Ally. Quality of tone does not relate to price but at the same time the price is Immaterial for me whether its a 10 $ whistle or 300$ whistle, if I can afford it of course!!
I have a sweetheart C but its a bit rougher and louder than the OB. The burke D I tried was sweet but a bit quite.
Depends on what you want from a whistle as to which is best!
what is the best whistle?
what is the best whistle?
I was playing in the tin whistle competition of the ulster fleadh recently. when i got the ajudication sheet back, it said that i should get a better whistle. i was playing a Eb generation whistle. also, i am often told that generation whistles are not that good.
Could someone please recommend a better type of whistle?
Thank you.
# Posted on August 7th 2009 by laveylad
Re: what is the best whistle?
Many great players used a generation whistle, although not often in Eb, but usually in D.
You can buy whistles for a fortune these days, Burke and so on, but personally I think a D whistle is a must.
# Posted on August 7th 2009 by bodhran bliss
Re: what is the best whistle?
I have a D whistle, but are Burke's any good? I've heard lots about them but i've never tried one.
# Posted on August 7th 2009 by laveylad
Re: what is the best whistle?
Burke whistles are very very good indeed. I highly recommend them. A bit more expensive than a generation, but definitely worth the cash.
# Posted on August 7th 2009 by Pat Mustard
Re: what is the best whistle?
I have two Burkes - D and Low D. Love 'em both.
# Posted on August 7th 2009 by feardearg
Re: what is the best whistle?
Dixon, Susato, Burke, there are loads to choose from, depends on what you want to spend.
# Posted on August 7th 2009 by bodhran bliss
Re: what is the best whistle?
"Many great players used a generation whistle, although not often in Eb, but usually in D."
I don't know what he rules are in a fleadh ceoil, but if you're playing on your own, it doesn't really matter what key your whistle's in. A lot of players *do* use Eb whistles on recordings and in performances. But in general, for session playing, you 'll need a D whistle.
Generation whistles can be great if you're lucky. But there are also a lot of dud ones, that sound squeaky or out of tune. Whatever whistle you buy, however cheap or expensive, you need to try *every single one* (not just each *type* - no two are exactly the same) before you make a decision. Many shops are reluctant to allow this nowadays, because of health and safety regulations. But they only need have a box of antiseptic wipes on hand to prevent the passing on of germs.
# Posted on August 7th 2009 by CreadurMawnOrganig
Re: what is the best whistle?
It is no doubt true to an extent that you get what you pay for - you can expect a better whistle for £120 than you'll get for £4. But in my experience, price and quality are not proportional - a John Sindt high D, for example, at £120, is better, but not 30 times better that the equivalent Generation whistle, at around £4. What you do get, I think, higher up the price range, is more consistency of quality - in fact, Generation whistles in particular are notorious for their inconsistency.
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by CreadurMawnOrganig
Re: what is the best whistle?
Get a rose whistle, honest to god they're the best, killian 'brien whistles are inconsistant, they're 190 sterling and are made from african blackwood, they're not good for a session because the tone is so soft and sweet and the high notes sound great too, I got my mine in an electric guitar shop in waterford for nothing! Get a sindt if you can't get the rose but hey Ive two munster fleadh medals playing slow airs on it and I honestly believe thats down to the quality of the whistle
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by premier
Re: what is the best whistle?
The Rose are 190, the obriens are 30 just to make myself clear
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by premier
Re: what is the best whistle?
Don't necessarily accept that the adjudicator was right. There might be nothing wrong with the Eb Generation at all. You were presumably happy enough with it up until then. I wouldn't change an instrument just to please some Comhaltas adjudicator. Did he/she suggest what might be a better instrument ?
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by Kenny
Re: what is the best whistle?
I play a session Burke in D , and I think its brilliant . I have on order a Fred Rose african blackwood however I ordered it in March and am still waiting.
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by Dave_
Re: what is the best whistle?
Oldskool Feadog's - your only man!
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by camwebby
Re: what is the best whistle?
+1 for a Fred Rose.
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by Sugarfoot Jack
Re: what is the best whistle?
I agree not to put everything on one adjudicator's opinion. Do you have any whistle/flute playing friends you respect? Let them play your whistle and see what they think. Paddy Maloney, Mary Bergin and others played some "OK" music on gen's for years.
That said, Burkes, Roses, Sindts and other are great sounding whistles. Sean Ryan sounds grand on a Susato (a whistle that only costs $30).
Personally, I love the sound of the DIxon trad (about $24) and Jerry Freeman's tweaked Blackbird and MellowDog whisltes ($36).
You have a lot of choices in a lot of price ranges. A really good whistle will not make you a better player unless your current whistle really does suck. So much of a whistles overall sound comes from you, the player.
Eric
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by Jayhawk
Re: what is the best whistle?
Cheers,everyone. Thanks for the advice.
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by laveylad
Re: what is the best whistle?
You can get a nice Dixon from Hobgoblin for about £16.
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by bodhran bliss
Re: what is the best whistle?
overton ~ colin or bernard
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by Ben Steen
Re: what is the best whistle?
I think ragaman has the sense of it. When your score card came back and said that you should get a better whistle, It didn't mean get a better make of whistle. It merely meant get a better whistle. The vast majority of Generations are dreadful. But there are gems.
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by ...
Re: what is the best whistle?
D.
Michael Burke
# Posted on August 8th 2009 by zippydw
Re: what is the best whistle?
The Overton (lost a few years ago when a bag was stolen)was great if a little loud, the Burke (lost froma bag a couple of weeks ago) was beautiful. the Susato is ok, loud enough for the session but not as sweet or clear as the Burke.
The Willie Simmonds that a very kind friend has loaned me is fabulous but maybe a little quiet for a noisy session ( he does make louder ones though)
The Generations now are pretty dire unless you're very lucky, or clever enough to tweak them which I am not. Perhaps I should go into a shop and buy one, play it there for a while and if it's rubbish exchange it, repeating the procedure until I either find a decent one or they run out of stock. Gen might take their quality more seriously if all the bad ones got returned. What do you think?
# Posted on August 9th 2009 by flossie
Re: what is the best whistle?
I think you better check your bag.
# Posted on August 9th 2009 by Skull Duggeraigh Dubh
Re: what is the best whistle?
I've had some nice whistles that were easy on the ears and hard on the wallet but the *best* whistle I ever had was an early 80s (late 70s?) model of a Feadóg. It's not the kind they're making today apparently. It had an angular head and a a really sweet sound right up into the third octave.
Echo all of the above.. when it comes down to it, the difference between bulk whistle makers (like Generation) and artisan whistle makers is the level of consistent quality (and reaction to any problems you have). You can get a quality whistle from a low end maker, but it may take some finding.
# Posted on August 9th 2009 by kothz
Re: what is the best whistle?
Don't even joke about it Duijera Dubh it's not a laughing matter
I'm still reeling (pardon the pun) from the loss of that Burke! 
Although I'll never be able to listen to it again without giggling! Oh dear.
The Happy Birthday from Joe Cocker did make me laugh though thanks for the link
# Posted on August 9th 2009 by flossie
Re: what is the best whistle?
No, it isn't a laughing matter. I'd think about carrying two bags, one as a decoy.
Yes, the Cocker link was a serious laughing matter. I don't know if that link is there anymore. Here's another then. It's a classic isn't it?! Joe Cocker was a national hero in these parts back then. A good part of the teenage population at the time used to strive to look and sound like that - some of them still do I would think:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpjNLjBbVd4
# Posted on August 9th 2009 by Skull Duggeraigh Dubh
Re: what is the best whistle?
You can't go far wrong with a Dixon Trad in brass for £15 from bigwhistle dot co dot uk. No shrillness or buzzing on any note and easy to play. Similar breath requirements as a Gen, well balanced between the notes.
# Posted on August 9th 2009 by blaydo
Re: what is the best whistle?
Quite recently i went out to by a set of cheap whistles in all different keys, the majority of which ended up being Generation whistles. they have quality control issues - quality varied vastly not only between whistles of the same keys but from key-to-key. the Eb whistles all had one thing in common - they sucked! i went through almost the entire store's stock before i found one that was just about passable and even then it is the most raspy whistle i ever had, so my consensus is that the Eb generations are not the bestest whistles ever...
...i found a gorgeous sweet little F though and the Bb is generally really nice. for a decent D i'd definitely recommed Dixon although susato have a nice one too.
# Posted on August 9th 2009 by Maestro McAllister
Re: what is the best whistle?
I have a number of Clarke's Sweetones, all from same shop, and all sound great and blow easily and feel right. A good whistle for a little outlay - about a fiver. You can then have them keep them in the car, in your bag, in the shed......!
# Posted on August 10th 2009 by flatfooter
Re: what is the best whistle?
tony dixon in d or a susato in d if your in a group
# Posted on April 15th 2010 by James Morgan
Re: what is the best whistle?
Bright, cheerful, sweet clear tone, great in sessions. A whistle worth having a relationship with. For me, it's my Fred Rose D. I'm not ready to swap!
# Posted on June 1st 2011 by Snij
Re: what is the best whistle?
Comhaltas adjudicators now habitually return 'get a better whistle' whenever a cheap (looking) whistle is being played irrespective of how well it sounds. I have seen some really really lovely sounding players (playing very nice Cillian O Briain improved whistles) get that advice and several people present at the competition were wondering if the adjudicator had actually listened to to the sounds played before him.
# Posted on June 1st 2011 by Prof. Prlwytzkofski
Re: what is the best whistle?
In some Scottish fiddle and accordion competitions the judges are behind a screen so they can't see who the performer is, let alone what instrument they're using. Doesn't Comhaltas ever do that?
# Posted on June 1st 2011 by Jack Campin
Re: what is the best whistle?
No, but it would be a good idea if they did.
# Posted on June 1st 2011 by Prof. Prlwytzkofski
Re: what is the best whistle?
I have a handful of Generation whistles. Not one of them plays as good or sounds as good as my Jerry Freeman Mellow Dog (which has a green head, making it my green whistle
).
This is especially true if you need to play a oxx ooo (C natural), which is always out of tune by a fair margin on a gen.
Competition is about raising standards. It don't really matter how many legendary performers have played Generation whistles in the past. What matters is what you can do to improve your performance next time -- since tone and tuning are part of the contest, the judge is telling you something you can do to improve. Take it or leave it, but it is what it is.
# Posted on June 1st 2011 by green whistler
Re: what is the best whistle?
It can be, but often it isn't. The cases I mentioned of the Cillian O Briain whistles being played would not have been improved by changing to a Sindt for example. It would have been different, but it would not have been an improvement. The adjudicator was taking his clues from the visual, seeing a green plastic head, not from listening to the actual whistle being played. And I was not the only one thinking that either.
It's the same thing as the concertina competitions, the loveliest top of the range Crabb won't do, competitors need to be seen playing a Jeffries, even if it's a very mediocre one murdered by poor restoration.
# Posted on June 1st 2011 by Prof. Prlwytzkofski
Re: what is the best whistle?
The only way you can know what the adjudicator was thinking is if he was you. It would be interesting to hear from the adjudicators what they think they are hearing -- and to see if they still hear it behind a screen.
Regardless, being out of tune can always be improved on. None of my Generation whistles is tuned very well. And that's with the head in the optimal position. Most of them shipped with the head jammed on too far and were even worse to begin with.
# Posted on June 1st 2011 by green whistler
Re: what is the best whistle?
Yep the old Feadogs from the 80 did me f'rom '84 to 2011 with the odd susato every now and thewn for volume.
. Now I use an Olivier Bouchard Whistle, which funnily enough was also the favourite choice at our little pipers club Ive just returned from . Class whistle IMO
Burkes are good, no doubt I have 2 low G's, one brass one Ally. Quality of tone does not relate to price but at the same time the price is Immaterial for me whether its a 10 $ whistle or 300$ whistle, if I can afford it of course!!
I have a sweetheart C but its a bit rougher and louder than the OB. The burke D I tried was sweet but a bit quite.
Depends on what you want from a whistle as to which is best!
Enjoy your tunes
# Posted on June 1st 2011 by piobagusfidil