"When you play music, regardless of your technical level, the music that comes out is who you are. So, as you go into this stuff, years go by, you're refining your musical expression, but it's becoming more and more who you are. It is kind of like your character, your personality, gets into it and becomes part of the process. It's important to keep that in mind from the beginning. No matter how much of a beginner you are, what you are playing is expressing who you are to the world. You can't hope it's going to be anything other than that. It's just the way it is. Anyway, it's fun."
It made me think of how when I really like a player, the best compliment I can give is something like "so much of his personality comes through in his playing".
Not sure where I'm going with this. But thought it was a nice quote.
Joel, I think the more technically proficient you become with your instrument, the less you have to worry about how technically proficient you are with your instrument.
Which, of course, would then allow you to concentrate on the music and do the expression thing here.
Nice, I can understand it, but I can't really associate with it. If I'm expressing anything to the world that is incidental. Same as it would be if I was talking to people in the pub, or, if on my own, if I was singing in the shower, or humming while walking in the woods. A bit like enjoying the view from a hilltop - have to climb the hill to see it and enjoy the walk getting there, do it alone, do it with friends.
Nice quote. Don't think I am going anywhere with it at the moment though.
I like the quote, too. I think a large part of understanding it is when he say, "...years go by, you're refining your musical expression..."
Slower music can be difficult that way. It usually isn't technically demanding. But, if you don't have some sort of experience with music/playing it won't have the energy or direction expression provides.
Not to say technically demanding music can't be expressive, too, though. I know players (we all do) who can play lots of "guszh-ga-duszh", but it's all flat-lined and void of musicality.
To develop expression, your heart needs to be in it. Otherwise, time really won't help you much.
There are times I have said I enjoy playing with musicians better than myself. Truth is I play with musicians who come of with things I don't always come up with on my own. So I suppose they express themselves (& the tunes) better than I do. I hope their style of expressing themselves sinks in.
And there is one more aspect: not only does your way of playing - and perhaps your increasing technical proficiency over the years - express who you are, but also - and I think this is perhaps even more important - your own personal choice of tunes (like: do you, perhaps subconsciously, prefer tunes in minor keys, etc)
I think Bays is right - something of you comes out in your playing, whatever your standard. The more interesting players of any type always have a recognisable personality that you can hear. There's nothing less inspiring than a bunch of technically accomplished but mechanical players
I don't think anyone would be able to suss who I was from listening to a recording of me playing, any more than I have a clue what Randall Bays is like from listening to him. I do, however, think that when you listen to someone who can't yet play you can quickly hear what they are like as a musician and that this musical thing, whatever it is, is there all the way along. For me it doesn't matter how technically proficient I get, the level of musicality doesn't change - much though I wish it would.
I like that.
I like getting to know muso's as people, and then hearing their style musically. Sometimes its really surprising. Other times its so predictable.
I'm not sure I'd think about it in terms of technical proficiency really. If you knew one tune and only that one tune forever, would you always play it the same? Some would I guess, but I'd imagine most people would probably try and express themselves a little. Change it around. I always did that before messing with technique. Its more fun.
I'm thinking about some friends of mine whose personalities have, for each one, as main peculiarity :
- precision
-anxiety
-superficiality
-lack of organizaton
- haughtiness
-Gentleness
In spite of their different technical levels, one can clearly tell those personalities by the way they play.
Hee hee! OK, this has gotten interesting, good call fiddlemax. Makes me think of my main homeboy who plays flute. Before he retired he was a programmer, a tech geek. I love to play with him, and now I'm thinking about how his playing reflects his techie, right brain and analytical mindset.
...and by extension, I wonder if my playing comes across as eccentric and left brain as my personality is.
Anyway, with each of us having half a brain, together it makes a nice full sound.
Yeah, goofy, mirthful, wacky, joyful, extremely left of center, yeah, actually, I think my playing reflects my personality a bit too much sometimes...a little right brain restraint might be in order...
Ok, so you can identify traits in the playing of people you know, but could you do the same thing of people you'd never met? Plus some people I don't much care for play great music and people I love I can hardly bear to listen to - but that would be to shift things from psychology to aesthetics. Anyhow, Matt Molloy seems a rather shy person in public places. I think about the best you can say is that a person's personality comes out in their playing because it's them playing it.
and surely getting good at playing music is a way of effacing your personality, getting away from it,, not getting deeper into it? When shy people get technically good at playing their shyness disappears when they are playing. I know loads of people like that.
pavlf... one can easily tell people personality by simply observing how they do simple actions like walking or eating.... or drinking!!!! Imagine how much you can capture by listenining and watching someone playing. think at the infinite variables you can notice whose combination is unique for that specific person. and, again, the technical skills don't interfere significatively on that. Perhaps,the more skilled the player, the clearer thepersonality
you said the "watching" word, not I! I imagine Matt Molloy is a bit shy because I've watched him. I'd never know it from listening to him playing the reel of mulinavat. I don't know why I'm using Matt Molloy here really, anyone would do.
You know how people who try to use a big vocabulary, but pronounce the words wrong, and use them in the wrong places, end up sounding like pompous idiots? Sometimes I feel my playing is like that......
There was this balalaika player who'd show up. Added an unusual timbre. He was domineering, mustachioed and cruel and it showed in his playing. Didn't show for awhile and finally we heard he'd moved back to Russia.
Then we saw his photo in the New York Times. Our "Balalaika Joe" was Joe Stalin. NY Times wrote long, glowing articles about him, how Joe's agricultural and industrial wonders were improving the lives of all Russians. Times even won a Pulitzer for their articles about our Joe!
Joe could rip through "Vodka Before Breakfast" like nobody's business.
I'm as bashful as an orphaned Disney® fawn. Predictably my guitar backing is wan, timid, barely audible. On whistle, I'm like a wounded sparrow. If ITM was more like light jazz, that's one elevator ride I'd be brave enough to take.
Expression
Expression
I found this in a Randal Bays interview recently:
"When you play music, regardless of your technical level, the music that comes out is who you are. So, as you go into this stuff, years go by, you're refining your musical expression, but it's becoming more and more who you are. It is kind of like your character, your personality, gets into it and becomes part of the process. It's important to keep that in mind from the beginning. No matter how much of a beginner you are, what you are playing is expressing who you are to the world. You can't hope it's going to be anything other than that. It's just the way it is. Anyway, it's fun."
It made me think of how when I really like a player, the best compliment I can give is something like "so much of his personality comes through in his playing".
Not sure where I'm going with this. But thought it was a nice quote.
# Posted on July 29th 2009 by kennedy
Re: Expression
Lovely stuff. Do you think that the more you become technically proficient, the more you can express your personality?
# Posted on July 29th 2009 by McDermott
Re: Expression
That is a nice quote.
Joel, I think the more technically proficient you become with your instrument, the less you have to worry about how technically proficient you are with your instrument.
Which, of course, would then allow you to concentrate on the music and do the expression thing here.
# Posted on July 29th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Expression
Nice, I can understand it, but I can't really associate with it. If I'm expressing anything to the world that is incidental. Same as it would be if I was talking to people in the pub, or, if on my own, if I was singing in the shower, or humming while walking in the woods. A bit like enjoying the view from a hilltop - have to climb the hill to see it and enjoy the walk getting there, do it alone, do it with friends.
Nice quote. Don't think I am going anywhere with it at the moment though.
# Posted on July 29th 2009 by David50
Re: Expression
I like the quote, too. I think a large part of understanding it is when he say, "...years go by, you're refining your musical expression..."
Slower music can be difficult that way. It usually isn't technically demanding. But, if you don't have some sort of experience with music/playing it won't have the energy or direction expression provides.
Not to say technically demanding music can't be expressive, too, though. I know players (we all do) who can play lots of "guszh-ga-duszh", but it's all flat-lined and void of musicality.
To develop expression, your heart needs to be in it. Otherwise, time really won't help you much.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by cfmgeek
Re: Expression
There are times I have said I enjoy playing with musicians better than myself. Truth is I play with musicians who come of with things I don't always come up with on my own. So I suppose they express themselves (& the tunes) better than I do. I hope their style of expressing themselves sinks in.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by Ben Steen
Re: Expression
And there is one more aspect: not only does your way of playing - and perhaps your increasing technical proficiency over the years - express who you are, but also - and I think this is perhaps even more important - your own personal choice of tunes (like: do you, perhaps subconsciously, prefer tunes in minor keys, etc)
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by alexweger
Re: Expression
I think Bays is right - something of you comes out in your playing, whatever your standard. The more interesting players of any type always have a recognisable personality that you can hear. There's nothing less inspiring than a bunch of technically accomplished but mechanical players
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by Bren
Re: Expression
I don't think anyone would be able to suss who I was from listening to a recording of me playing, any more than I have a clue what Randall Bays is like from listening to him. I do, however, think that when you listen to someone who can't yet play you can quickly hear what they are like as a musician and that this musical thing, whatever it is, is there all the way along. For me it doesn't matter how technically proficient I get, the level of musicality doesn't change - much though I wish it would.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by pavlf
Re: Expression
I like that.
I like getting to know muso's as people, and then hearing their style musically. Sometimes its really surprising. Other times its so predictable.
I'm not sure I'd think about it in terms of technical proficiency really. If you knew one tune and only that one tune forever, would you always play it the same? Some would I guess, but I'd imagine most people would probably try and express themselves a little. Change it around. I always did that before messing with technique. Its more fun.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by Hugo Chavez
Re: Expression
I'm thinking about some friends of mine whose personalities have, for each one, as main peculiarity :
- precision
-anxiety
-superficiality
-lack of organizaton
- haughtiness
-Gentleness
In spite of their different technical levels, one can clearly tell those personalities by the way they play.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by fiddlemax
Re: Expression
Hee hee! OK, this has gotten interesting, good call fiddlemax. Makes me think of my main homeboy who plays flute. Before he retired he was a programmer, a tech geek. I love to play with him, and now I'm thinking about how his playing reflects his techie, right brain and analytical mindset.
...and by extension, I wonder if my playing comes across as eccentric and left brain as my personality is.
Anyway, with each of us having half a brain, together it makes a nice full sound.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Expression
Yeah, goofy, mirthful, wacky, joyful, extremely left of center, yeah, actually, I think my playing reflects my personality a bit too much sometimes...a little right brain restraint might be in order...
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Expression
Ok, so you can identify traits in the playing of people you know, but could you do the same thing of people you'd never met? Plus some people I don't much care for play great music and people I love I can hardly bear to listen to - but that would be to shift things from psychology to aesthetics. Anyhow, Matt Molloy seems a rather shy person in public places. I think about the best you can say is that a person's personality comes out in their playing because it's them playing it.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by pavlf
Re: Expression
and surely getting good at playing music is a way of effacing your personality, getting away from it,, not getting deeper into it? When shy people get technically good at playing their shyness disappears when they are playing. I know loads of people like that.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by pavlf
Re: Expression
pavlf... one can easily tell people personality by simply observing how they do simple actions like walking or eating.... or drinking!!!! Imagine how much you can capture by listenining and watching someone playing. think at the infinite variables you can notice whose combination is unique for that specific person. and, again, the technical skills don't interfere significatively on that. Perhaps,the more skilled the player, the clearer thepersonality
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by fiddlemax
Re: Expression
you said the "watching" word, not I!
I imagine Matt Molloy is a bit shy because I've watched him. I'd never know it from listening to him playing the reel of mulinavat. I don't know why I'm using Matt Molloy here really, anyone would do.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by pavlf
Re: Expression
You know how people who try to use a big vocabulary, but pronounce the words wrong, and use them in the wrong places, end up sounding like pompous idiots? Sometimes I feel my playing is like that......
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by AlBrown
Re: Expression
There was this balalaika player who'd show up. Added an unusual timbre. He was domineering, mustachioed and cruel and it showed in his playing. Didn't show for awhile and finally we heard he'd moved back to Russia.
Then we saw his photo in the New York Times. Our "Balalaika Joe" was Joe Stalin. NY Times wrote long, glowing articles about him, how Joe's agricultural and industrial wonders were improving the lives of all Russians. Times even won a Pulitzer for their articles about our Joe!
Joe could rip through "Vodka Before Breakfast" like nobody's business.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by NEW Pure Drop® Ear Canal Oil
Re: Expression
Da Comrade. In Soviet Russia, tunes play YOU!
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Expression
I'm as bashful as an orphaned Disney® fawn. Predictably my guitar backing is wan, timid, barely audible. On whistle, I'm like a wounded sparrow. If ITM was more like light jazz, that's one elevator ride I'd be brave enough to take.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by NEW Pure Drop® Ear Canal Oil
Re: Expression
SWFL—Have you heard modern rekordinks of Putin playink many impressive tunes on his medvedev? Is fine instrument for Vlad.
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by NEW Pure Drop® Ear Canal Oil
Re: Expression
So what is this type of 'expression' caused by - concentration or lack of sleep??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7z9iPVNYsE
# Posted on July 30th 2009 by Free Reed
Re: Expression
I thought it was supposed to be "Vodka For Breakfast"
# Posted on August 10th 2009 by fauxcelt