It should go without saying that the kind of ITM that this site is about is dance music. Good sessions of course have plenty of non-dance music as well, but that is the leavening. The body of the music is dance music.
Along with bizarre claims like "you can't play the music unless you know the Irish language" (no, I don't want to raise that one) there is a much more serious point that session players would be better, would "feel" the music more directly, if they also learnt dance. I don't know *how* important that point is, but it does seem to make a certain sense.
But given the conflict between, on the one hand, the terrible cliches of the R-dance syndrome and the often sexless qualities of Irish dance and music on the other, wouldn't it perhaps be good if some of us "tune-istas" learnt some kind of latin dance? If we got a more passionate, even erotic feeling into our bones, perhaps it would inform our tuneplaying in a more exciting way than clattering away on a piece of chipboard ever could.
HA! Sure, why not. I used to breakdance when I was a kid in the 80s.
Just shake it, whatever it is, I concur. People get so uptight because they can't dance like the girls with the curls, so they sit there and don't move while this amazingly magical, soulful and rhythmic music is playing. I don't mean that the hippie chicks should get up and swirl their paisley dresses like it's Shakedown Street at a Dead concert, but yeah, a little soul and shimmying wouldn't do anyone any harm, considering we are playing the most soulful and rhythmic music on the planet. Ahem.
SWFL - you know why the hippies dance like that, right?
...it's to keep the music out of their eyes.
As for dancing, I'm all for it, if there's room. Some of the bars are pretty close-packed, and one of those swing dancing pitch-your-partner-over-your-head moves could wreak all kinds of havoc. Breakdancing, too, might be tricky to fit in, though I'd love to see you try.
I've always thought that if irish dances is so... how to say... straight ? was because it was difficult to dance with big hip movements in a pub stacked with people... a wee bit like why gipsy guitar players hold their instrument vertically : Ever tried to play guitar normally when you're 50 people in a caravan ?
But notwithstanding the jokes : being able to dance a little, even if it's not the dance you're playing, did improve my playing : finding the good tempo, for instance, giving the right impulse... i.e. playing a polka that sounds and feel like a polka for the eventual dancer... and of course feeling the music in the body (no, Ptarm, I'm not reffering to your last thread !), specially the rythm and emphasis...
I find set dancing can be very sexy. It's a full contact dance between consenting adults.
Since the church tried to ban it the pope and I agree on this.
I'm a dancer who is completely hooked (albeit less on set dancing than on french folk dancing). I'm trying to teach myself some sean nos.
While I'm sure that many musicians would benefit from learning to dance, I don't think that "dance music" is (or should be) a major attribute of "session music".
Some points which support this claim:
- many dancers who have no clue about music (not only playing it, but have little sense of discrimination)
- many excellent musicians who have no clue about dancing
- the variety of lovely ways tunes can be arranged (or simply played) that would annoy the heck out of dancers
- the elements of the tradition which aren't made for dancing
- the fact that sessions have been going strong for around 50 years with a near complete absence of dancing.
- the jealousy some French feel that irish sessions (opportunities to play music together regularly without pandering to the bl***dy dancers) are so numerous.
How bout the idea of a trad disco? A social dance with trad music... It's been tried at a few festivals here in Oz with great success. They're a great chance for everyone to just dance to the music with without needing to be able to step/set dance.
We had a great one in my friend's kitchen a few weeks ago. They are soo much fun!
If you want to see this music in its native habitat, go to the dances (contra dance, set dances and so forth). It is very personable and close. You get to dance with the people you are dancing with, so to speak, not just moving about to the music. All the Contra dances that I have gone have had live music. Going to a dance will not harm your playing in any way shape or form.
If this old geezer got up from a session to dance...
One, it would probably mean I have been shamelessly taking advantage of our pub's offer of free drinks to players.
Two, it would not make the feeling for the music more passionate - but it might inspire laughter.
Three, I would be in one of those hospital beds the next day with arms and legs up in slings while I underwent emergency arthritis treatment.
I play bodhran and bones. The Ragu's is upon me. My problem is when I play and things get lively - people get up to dance and really enjoy themselves. This causes a backlash from our anti percussion session members.
Dance and tuneplaying
Dance and tuneplaying
It should go without saying that the kind of ITM that this site is about is dance music. Good sessions of course have plenty of non-dance music as well, but that is the leavening. The body of the music is dance music.
Along with bizarre claims like "you can't play the music unless you know the Irish language" (no, I don't want to raise that one) there is a much more serious point that session players would be better, would "feel" the music more directly, if they also learnt dance. I don't know *how* important that point is, but it does seem to make a certain sense.
But given the conflict between, on the one hand, the terrible cliches of the R-dance syndrome and the often sexless qualities of Irish dance and music on the other, wouldn't it perhaps be good if some of us "tune-istas" learnt some kind of latin dance? If we got a more passionate, even erotic feeling into our bones, perhaps it would inform our tuneplaying in a more exciting way than clattering away on a piece of chipboard ever could.
Has anybody tried this?
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by Linsey Doyle
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
Your Joking right? There was sean-nos from old and young in the session last night and set dancing too , but no salsa!
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by piobagusfidil
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
Yes, I'm a big fan of meringue.
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by Bren
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
HA! Sure, why not. I used to breakdance when I was a kid in the 80s.
Just shake it, whatever it is, I concur. People get so uptight because they can't dance like the girls with the curls, so they sit there and don't move while this amazingly magical, soulful and rhythmic music is playing. I don't mean that the hippie chicks should get up and swirl their paisley dresses like it's Shakedown Street at a Dead concert, but yeah, a little soul and shimmying wouldn't do anyone any harm, considering we are playing the most soulful and rhythmic music on the planet. Ahem.
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
SWFL - you know why the hippies dance like that, right?
...it's to keep the music out of their eyes.
As for dancing, I'm all for it, if there's room. Some of the bars are pretty close-packed, and one of those swing dancing pitch-your-partner-over-your-head moves could wreak all kinds of havoc. Breakdancing, too, might be tricky to fit in, though I'd love to see you try.
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
I've taken a few tango lessons over the years. It has directly and tremendously influenced the way I play polkas.....
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by Will Harmon
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
I've always thought that if irish dances is so... how to say... straight ? was because it was difficult to dance with big hip movements in a pub stacked with people... a wee bit like why gipsy guitar players hold their instrument vertically : Ever tried to play guitar normally when you're 50 people in a caravan ?
But notwithstanding the jokes : being able to dance a little, even if it's not the dance you're playing, did improve my playing : finding the good tempo, for instance, giving the right impulse... i.e. playing a polka that sounds and feel like a polka for the eventual dancer... and of course feeling the music in the body (no, Ptarm, I'm not reffering to your last thread !), specially the rythm and emphasis...
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by Nikita Pfister
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
I find set dancing can be very sexy. It's a full contact dance between consenting adults.
Since the church tried to ban it the pope and I agree on this.
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by bazouki dave
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
huh?
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by AlBrown
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
I'm a dancer who is completely hooked (albeit less on set dancing than on french folk dancing). I'm trying to teach myself some sean nos.
While I'm sure that many musicians would benefit from learning to dance, I don't think that "dance music" is (or should be) a major attribute of "session music".
Some points which support this claim:
- many dancers who have no clue about music (not only playing it, but have little sense of discrimination)
- many excellent musicians who have no clue about dancing
- the variety of lovely ways tunes can be arranged (or simply played) that would annoy the heck out of dancers
- the elements of the tradition which aren't made for dancing
- the fact that sessions have been going strong for around 50 years with a near complete absence of dancing.
- the jealousy some French feel that irish sessions (opportunities to play music together regularly without pandering to the bl***dy dancers) are so numerous.
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by Tirno
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
How bout the idea of a trad disco? A social dance with trad music... It's been tried at a few festivals here in Oz with great success. They're a great chance for everyone to just dance to the music with without needing to be able to step/set dance.
We had a great one in my friend's kitchen a few weeks ago. They are soo much fun!
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by davydd
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
What is a "social dance" where you "just dance"?
Seems to take the whole "social" out of social dance to me.
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by Tirno
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
Latin dance? Like 'calamus corni', for example?
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by CreadurMawnOrganig
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
Jon, I'm much too old for that now, I may 'break' something if I tried.
# Posted on April 27th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
If you want to see this music in its native habitat, go to the dances (contra dance, set dances and so forth). It is very personable and close. You get to dance with the people you are dancing with, so to speak, not just moving about to the music. All the Contra dances that I have gone have had live music. Going to a dance will not harm your playing in any way shape or form.
# Posted on April 28th 2009 by toumi
Re: Dance and tuneplaying
If this old geezer got up from a session to dance...
One, it would probably mean I have been shamelessly taking advantage of our pub's offer of free drinks to players.
Two, it would not make the feeling for the music more passionate - but it might inspire laughter.
Three, I would be in one of those hospital beds the next day with arms and legs up in slings while I underwent emergency arthritis treatment.
I play bodhran and bones. The Ragu's is upon me. My problem is when I play and things get lively - people get up to dance and really enjoy themselves. This causes a backlash from our anti percussion session members.
# Posted on May 5th 2009 by Micheál