Recent research at the Royal College of Music has shown that students, who were able to increase their brain's relative output of alpha/theta waves, were also able to significantly improve their musical performance ratings.
Shamans have known for a long time that a classic way of entering the Spirit World is by using a steady rhythm of drumming of about 200-280 beats per minute. This encourages theta brain waves that induce the altered state of consciousness required to travel to the Spirit Worlds.
Therefore the presence of a bodhran drummer at a session probably increases the performance rating of all players at that session. To maximise this benefit, the bodhranist should produce that steady rhythm of 200-280 bpm, whenever possible. Hands up, those who have not yet realised that they have benefited from this phenomenon!
Scraper, what's all this about alpha/theta waves, drumming and Spirit Worlds? Is there a web address you could give us to look at?
(...entering Spirit World at the moment with aid of cider and enhanced tobacco, having just listened to "The Art of Memory" by Fred Frith and John Zorn. Marvellous!...)
Spot on Scraper (and from a Fiddler?)
I'd watch out though some trad musicians will run a mile from an altered state of consciousness, and find the whole subject of session Mysticism embarrassing.
I don
greenman: Thanks. here are some URL's to try. http://www.zoningin.rcm.ac.uk/ here you will find the details of their research project if you climb over the academic terminology fence.
Bodhrans might have the aforementioned effect, but only when played by musicians.
How long would I have to play before the bodhran "players" departed into the spirit world? On second thoughts, not a good idea. I already have nightmares about them, I don't want haunting as well.
What next .. a seance with a wine glass and goatskin ouija bodhran?
Sounds to me like you are refering to a large ceremonial tom tom that 4 Indians sit around pounding and chanting. I don't see the relationship between your theory and a bodhran. Sorry.
So shamans are tribal healers. Maybe we could round up all the bodhran players in the world and send them out to Southern Africa, where AIDS and HIV are decimating the populations, see if they can beat out a cure for those unfortunate people there.
I suspect the only thing to happen would be the pain induced by the din of the bodhrans would only serve to keep their minds off their true suffering for a while.
If these alpha/theta waves have a beneficial effect on the session players (assuming you've got a good bodhranist who knows what s/he's doing), then wouldn't they have a similar beneficial effect on the punters propping up the bar?
Trevor
Hi Scraper, I see that you are a fiddler. Warm regards in your attempt to acknowledge a positive benefit from drummers. As you can tell, there is a great deal of Freudian "drum envy" amongst the twangers and tooters against the drummers, They love a moment of opportunity to attempt a slander or derision a'gain us, as in Danny's suggestion that they be sent to Africa to cure aids. Wha-tha-phfa? Speaking of scaaaping... that's scraping the bottom of the barrel looking for an insult. Best you can do, D????
If however, you are truly looking for an example of percussion as mysticism, try the Japanese Percussion Ensemble, Kodo, whom I have seen in concert many times, it is a spiritual experience and while i don't know about theta waves, you will be transfixed in their presence.
Has anyone out there read a book, "The Bodhran Makers" ... I've been looking for a copy. It sort of follows Scrapers logic in that somehow, the bodhran is identified as an instrument of the devil and there is an attempt to have them banned, and the makers burned at the stake, by a cult of breakaway priests...... something to this effect. (Save yer breath - and yer penknife remarks, drum haters, there have been efforts to make every instrument and style of music an act of the devil over time, from the devil dancing an playing the fiddle - while Rome burns, - to Elvis Presley playing his guitar and swiveling his hips to Blue Swede Shoes - so get over yerselves!!!).
Ruff - honestly, why did you have to lower the tone and start talking about members of the anatomy? Of course, when I was talking about contraception, I never meant that the bodhran could be used like a large female condom. Its effect would kick in long before that. If you simply walk round with a bodhran under your arm, nobody will ever have sex with you ever again...
Yeah that was a bit rough, ruff, apologies. I play the goatskin myself. I do get somewhat bemused by all the new age mysticism clap-trap going around these days, especially when it's to the detriment of modern medicine based on good science. I should have thought up something where bodhran players didn't get caught in the crossfire of my remarks, but there you go.
Decimate - to deal with one in ten. I think we want more bodhrans doing than that!
The abuse of the word decimate reminds me of Americans inventing Y2K because they didn't do latin at school and hence didn't know about MM (it happens in England as well).
No kidding Zina....thanks for the invitation. I'll be glad to go away. Every discussion that has been raised in the forum regarding my instrument has a huge sign on it's forehead - IMMEDIATE NOTICE TO ALL WANKERS AND POSERS - please jump in with your worst insults and most disruptive comments. I should have learned my lesson the last 9 topics ago, I've had enough participation for sure.
Geoff, my information is that Latin is more alive and well in the USA than it is in the UK, so no excuse for Y2K! Having said that, Latin is making something of a revival in the UK; at least one of the Harry Potter books is now available in Latin, translated by Peter Needham, a university don.
Trevor
Charlie, unfortunately that's part of the whole parcel, I'm afraid. Don't get them started on banjos, either, or the box, the other two instruments that automatically come in for abuse. It's why the first requirement for bodhran, banjo and box players is a hide thicker than a rhino. The whole "slagging" thing is a cultural thing in Ireland and others of the Isles Formerly Known As British, one that most born and raised outside of those environs find very difficult to comprehend and deal with, a fact that (ahem ahem) those coming from those places might keep in mind...
I've an Irish friend in Chicago who has an American wife and has lived in the States now for years and years and years. He finds himself curtailing the slagging til he gets back home for a visit but has to watch himself for a bit when returning to the States, because while his wife can deal (in a rather bemused fashion) with the slagging in Ireland, she finds her feelings very hurt when he does it at home in Chicago, as he's learned to his cost.
Besides which, you must understand that most bodhran players are not musicians/professional drummers such as yourself. The vast majority are those who want to play *some* thing and figure the drum is an easy mark. With rather predictable results. So it's something of a tradition within the tradition (within the comparatively few years the bodhran has been part of the tradition) to make fun of it's players.
I've been down the path with slagging, in the right context it is great sport and boisterous commeraderie - Yet it is easy enough to discern who is doing it with a twinkle in their eye, or with a chip on their shoulder. I can read the above remarks and draw the line with no trouble. This forum is an exclusive club, for fiddles and flutes. So be it. Our forum hasn't yet been devised, but maybe, ...in time. Cheers.
To make Ruff feel better...I am a fiddler (and this site is NOT exclusive to us and flute players....even if it seems like that) but I really value our bodhran player.. Pete O'Brien. As I said in a previous posting he is one of the reasons I joined my present band. His energy, taste and sublime technique really move the band along nicely.
Mind you I was THE melody instrument for a bodhran workshop once when I was surrounded by no less than 17 of the beasts (many with Guinness printed on them..'nuff said)...one of my more bizarre afternoons and not one I have been asked to repeat. Can't think why.
BTW Danny, stop boasting. One vertical was enough.
hey, apology accepted, my friend... I was just slagging on you a little bit. Geoff's remarks about his drummer Pete did it for me,.... that, and the rolls on the rain stick... hoohah!
I've discovered that the incantations on the bodhran are much more effective with insense, and candles, and dark rum, gives it a kind of gypsy/voodoo vibe. Black eyeliner apparently helps, but there are some lines I won't cross.
What do you call a person who likes to hang around Irish musicians?
A Bodhran player.....
Sorry I couldn't resist. Actually there is a really good drummer who plays occasionally at our session. His partner plays fiddle so he knows the tunes he accompanies. It's great to have them both at the session. I personally enjoy playing my flute with his bodhran playing. BUT most folks who show up at our session with a drum are not very good for the reasons Zina mentioned above. Good post Zina (as usual)! So Irish Ruff, if you have done your homework, we'd love to have you drop by our neck of the woods for a tune....
Hey Irish Ruff, look on the bright side: at least you don't drip on people in a session or have to worry about mold growing in your instrument. My buddies tell me that flute is the grossest instrument.....um..although I'm kinda proud of that : )
But Zina, you know as well as I do that if someone starts whingeing "you've hurt my feelings" and threatens to flounce off and not participate anymore, it simply makes a slagger all the more likely to reoffend
Only if it's you, Mark. *grin* Everybody else tends to start remembering this is an international site, so everybody has to lend a little slack...ahem, ahem... *snort*
........ Oh, now that's a fine kick in the shin, dow...
My inclination is to stick around and argue, but given the fact that I've had a very good day in my business, the best one in months, and that just today I discovered a celtic site with videos featuring closeups of Flooks drummer playing the very drum that Gerhard Kress has made for me, and posted over three weeks ago, (www.kerrywhistle.com\videos) I am going to decline the bait and head out this evening to make-merry...
Lets get this bodhranist bashing into perspective. (and I'll try, without being offencive)
Zina's post earlier about the majority just wanting to join in is the best insight yet. These terrible players (the majority) are meerly sad and lonely and deserve only pity, definatly not inclusion.
It's the other sort, the ones who can play, who are more complicated to deal with. Yes, their inclusion in a good session can be benificial, but I will not accept that that is all there is to it. A good musician is a good musician, and I implore anyone who ever meets such a good musician who is content to meerly bang such a pathetically primative instrument, to find some way of rousing them out of their contentment. They have no excuse. Learn a decent instrument.
Lets face it folks, what you're up against is something like this:
A bad player can spoil a session, regardless of what instrument is being played. See the discussion on "Whats the worst session you ever been to".
What happens is that a bad bodhran player is (like egg shakers) more easily able to join in than say a poor fiddle player - simply because its easier to bash a bodhran at the right speed but badly, than to play a fiddle at the right speed but badly. We have, over the years, had various dreadful non-musical players at our friday session. There was one woman who even drew the comment from someone that "clapping is so much better if it is in time with the music". Then there was the man who wanted to play the bones while someone played a very moving slow air on the flute.
The real skill that is so often lacking is the human skill of treating these people with the respect that any human being deserves, while getting them to see that they are actually detracting from the session. Perhaps I have been spoiled rotten by attending a session where the warmth of the people has almost always overridden anyones inclination to be harsh or unpleasant.
Three cheers for all the good bodhran players who take the buffeting that we all deal to them in good humour.
For all those who have never had the good fortune to hear good use of the bodhran: - get about a bit and find someone who does it well, don't just moan.
You know, I agree with everything that has been posted here. (except Tanya, that I am "merely" an amazing player - I prefer "extraordinarially amazing" - love you, dear).
Now, the drummers have really made some progress in the quest for musical recognition of our chosen vice..!.. And I start the day, a happy man... best regards to all.
This site would be no fun without the slagging lads! I dont think some of you would last 1 second in the sessions I go to, the slagging on this site is lame compared to the way we go about each other in real life (well okay - the way *i* go about slagging!) Maybe we should all grow a bit of a sense of humour PS I love bodhrans!
In what way, Geoff? It's my understanding that the cyber-security-geek-programmer types (I get to call them that, I'm the only pseudo-geek in two families of true geeks) invented the Y2K designation because of the 00 problem inherent to the design of most computer software, so therefore, it's the number 00 (repetitive to 00 referring to 1900) that was the trouble, purely a numbers issue and not actually a year reference. In other words, which is why they started calling it a Y2K design bug, which has nothing to do with the millenium.
Irish Ruff,
The Bohran Makers by John B.Keane . SBN 0-86322-085-1pbk hope this helps ,mines a 1988 copy no idea how I got if or if it's still in print I must re read it, although as I recall not too much on making Bodhrans.
Pajic
Zina is quite correct about not being a millenium problem. I reported a bug to a well known software manufacturer and was told this was low priority as it would happen ever 100 years so was not a millenium bug.
My comment was that the first people to use the phrase thought that 2K was the correct way to designate 2000 in Latin numerals.
Gee, you people really like to make fun of people huh?
But what if someone asks something he/she thinks is serious..
I don't know with Irish and English people, but here we don't got no similar behaviours, you would simply get an enemy if you acted like that here. (with the exeption if you know the person quite well).
Weird folks.
And I still can't figure out why you hate bodhran playing/players that bad, I think it's very cool.
DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Recent research at the Royal College of Music has shown that students, who were able to increase their brain's relative output of alpha/theta waves, were also able to significantly improve their musical performance ratings.
Shamans have known for a long time that a classic way of entering the Spirit World is by using a steady rhythm of drumming of about 200-280 beats per minute. This encourages theta brain waves that induce the altered state of consciousness required to travel to the Spirit Worlds.
Therefore the presence of a bodhran drummer at a session probably increases the performance rating of all players at that session. To maximise this benefit, the bodhranist should produce that steady rhythm of 200-280 bpm, whenever possible. Hands up, those who have not yet realised that they have benefited from this phenomenon!
# Posted on July 27th 2003 by scraper
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Yeah I've heard of people ending up in trance like states due to bodhran players!
# Posted on July 27th 2003 by richrua
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Lol! Nice one, Richrua!
Scraper, what's all this about alpha/theta waves, drumming and Spirit Worlds? Is there a web address you could give us to look at?
(...entering Spirit World at the moment with aid of cider and enhanced tobacco, having just listened to "The Art of Memory" by Fred Frith and John Zorn. Marvellous!...)
# Posted on July 27th 2003 by greenman
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Oh, sorry Scraper. A bit slow... "Lol! Nice one!" 2 U 2
# Posted on July 27th 2003 by greenman
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Spot on Scraper (and from a Fiddler?)
I'd watch out though some trad musicians will run a mile from an altered state of consciousness, and find the whole subject of session Mysticism embarrassing.
I don
# Posted on July 27th 2003 by Pied Piper
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
greenman: Thanks. here are some URL's to try. http://www.zoningin.rcm.ac.uk/ here you will find the details of their research project if you climb over the academic terminology fence.
For non-local spirit worlds try http://members.lycos.co.uk/innervoice/journey.html
I thought things were getting a bit slow in here so I brought out the long handled spoons .
Have one in your local spirit world for me tonight.
# Posted on July 27th 2003 by scraper
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Bodhrans might have the aforementioned effect, but only when played by musicians.
How long would I have to play before the bodhran "players" departed into the spirit world? On second thoughts, not a good idea. I already have nightmares about them, I don't want haunting as well.
What next .. a seance with a wine glass and goatskin ouija bodhran?
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by geoffwright
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Sounds to me like you are refering to a large ceremonial tom tom that 4 Indians sit around pounding and chanting. I don't see the relationship between your theory and a bodhran. Sorry.
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by irish ruff
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Hey Scraper! Thanx for the linx. Long-handled spoons they may be, but they stir up some arcane but interesting stuff!
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by greenman
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS -why not?
So shamans are tribal healers. Maybe we could round up all the bodhran players in the world and send them out to Southern Africa, where AIDS and HIV are decimating the populations, see if they can beat out a cure for those unfortunate people there.
I suspect the only thing to happen would be the pain induced by the din of the bodhrans would only serve to keep their minds off their true suffering for a while.
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by Rudall the time
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
ruff: Its not the type of skin that it is being beaten, but the frequency of beating it.
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by scraper
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Apologies: for ruff, read Charlie
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by scraper
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
If these alpha/theta waves have a beneficial effect on the session players (assuming you've got a good bodhranist who knows what s/he's doing), then wouldn't they have a similar beneficial effect on the punters propping up the bar?
Trevor
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by Trevor Jennings
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Hi Scraper, I see that you are a fiddler. Warm regards in your attempt to acknowledge a positive benefit from drummers. As you can tell, there is a great deal of Freudian "drum envy" amongst the twangers and tooters against the drummers, They love a moment of opportunity to attempt a slander or derision a'gain us, as in Danny's suggestion that they be sent to Africa to cure aids. Wha-tha-phfa? Speaking of scaaaping... that's scraping the bottom of the barrel looking for an insult. Best you can do, D????
If however, you are truly looking for an example of percussion as mysticism, try the Japanese Percussion Ensemble, Kodo, whom I have seen in concert many times, it is a spiritual experience and while i don't know about theta waves, you will be transfixed in their presence.
Has anyone out there read a book, "The Bodhran Makers" ... I've been looking for a copy. It sort of follows Scrapers logic in that somehow, the bodhran is identified as an instrument of the devil and there is an attempt to have them banned, and the makers burned at the stake, by a cult of breakaway priests...... something to this effect. (Save yer breath - and yer penknife remarks, drum haters, there have been efforts to make every instrument and style of music an act of the devil over time, from the devil dancing an playing the fiddle - while Rome burns, - to Elvis Presley playing his guitar and swiveling his hips to Blue Swede Shoes - so get over yerselves!!!).
Cheers to all,
Ruff!
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by irish ruff
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
I don't know Ruff, there's an element of seriousness in Danny's suggestion. A bodhran would make a mighty effective contraceptive.
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by Dr. Dow
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
ha, and in the both of your cases, so might a whistle make an effective contraceptive. ........ just tape over the fipple and finger holes....
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by irish ruff
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Oh God, the three of you, go away, will you? ;)
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by Zina Lee
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Ruff - honestly, why did you have to lower the tone and start talking about members of the anatomy?
Of course, when I was talking about contraception, I never meant that the bodhran could be used like a large female condom. Its effect would kick in long before that. If you simply walk round with a bodhran under your arm, nobody will ever have sex with you ever again...
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by Dr. Dow
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Yeah that was a bit rough, ruff, apologies. I play the goatskin myself. I do get somewhat bemused by all the new age mysticism clap-trap going around these days, especially when it's to the detriment of modern medicine based on good science. I should have thought up something where bodhran players didn't get caught in the crossfire of my remarks, but there you go.
Danny.
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by Rudall the time
Re: DON'T DecimateTHE BODHRANISTS
Decimate - to deal with one in ten. I think we want more bodhrans doing than that!
The abuse of the word decimate reminds me of Americans inventing Y2K because they didn't do latin at school and hence didn't know about MM (it happens in England as well).
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by geoffwright
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
No kidding Zina....thanks for the invitation. I'll be glad to go away. Every discussion that has been raised in the forum regarding my instrument has a huge sign on it's forehead - IMMEDIATE NOTICE TO ALL WANKERS AND POSERS - please jump in with your worst insults and most disruptive comments. I should have learned my lesson the last 9 topics ago, I've had enough participation for sure.
# Posted on July 28th 2003 by irish ruff
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Geoff, my information is that Latin is more alive and well in the USA than it is in the UK, so no excuse for Y2K! Having said that, Latin is making something of a revival in the UK; at least one of the Harry Potter books is now available in Latin, translated by Peter Needham, a university don.
Trevor
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Trevor Jennings
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Hi Irish ruff.
Don't worry about the sheeple passing of other people
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Pied Piper
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Charlie, unfortunately that's part of the whole parcel, I'm afraid. Don't get them started on banjos, either, or the box, the other two instruments that automatically come in for abuse. It's why the first requirement for bodhran, banjo and box players is a hide thicker than a rhino. The whole "slagging" thing is a cultural thing in Ireland and others of the Isles Formerly Known As British, one that most born and raised outside of those environs find very difficult to comprehend and deal with, a fact that (ahem ahem) those coming from those places might keep in mind...
I've an Irish friend in Chicago who has an American wife and has lived in the States now for years and years and years. He finds himself curtailing the slagging til he gets back home for a visit but has to watch himself for a bit when returning to the States, because while his wife can deal (in a rather bemused fashion) with the slagging in Ireland, she finds her feelings very hurt when he does it at home in Chicago, as he's learned to his cost.
Besides which, you must understand that most bodhran players are not musicians/professional drummers such as yourself. The vast majority are those who want to play *some* thing and figure the drum is an easy mark. With rather predictable results. So it's something of a tradition within the tradition (within the comparatively few years the bodhran has been part of the tradition) to make fun of it's players.
Zina
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Zina Lee
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Actually, as re: Y2K -- that wasn't a Latin thing, that was a computer thing. For a geek, that was the way you abbreviated Year Two Thousand, y'see.
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Zina Lee
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
I've been down the path with slagging, in the right context it is great sport and boisterous commeraderie - Yet it is easy enough to discern who is doing it with a twinkle in their eye, or with a chip on their shoulder. I can read the above remarks and draw the line with no trouble. This forum is an exclusive club, for fiddles and flutes. So be it. Our forum hasn't yet been devised, but maybe, ...in time. Cheers.
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by irish ruff
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Hell. I've already apologised. What else can I do on line? show you my bollox?
I
OO
Danny.
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Rudall the time
or...
..I
..I
OO
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Rudall the time
Bleaaggghhhh!!!
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Rudall the time
.
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Rudall the time
>
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Rudall the time
\
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Rudall the time
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
To make Ruff feel better...I am a fiddler (and this site is NOT exclusive to us and flute players....even if it seems like that) but I really value our bodhran player.. Pete O'Brien. As I said in a previous posting he is one of the reasons I joined my present band. His energy, taste and sublime technique really move the band along nicely.
Mind you I was THE melody instrument for a bodhran workshop once when I was surrounded by no less than 17 of the beasts (many with Guinness printed on them..'nuff said)...one of my more bizarre afternoons and not one I have been asked to repeat. Can't think why.
BTW Danny, stop boasting. One vertical was enough.
I'm off to practice rolls on my rainstick.
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Geoff Pollitt
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
....000
...__
../
..|
OO
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Rudall the time
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
hey, apology accepted, my friend... I was just slagging on you a little bit. Geoff's remarks about his drummer Pete did it for me,.... that, and the rolls on the rain stick... hoohah!
I've discovered that the incantations on the bodhran are much more effective with insense, and candles, and dark rum, gives it a kind of gypsy/voodoo vibe. Black eyeliner apparently helps, but there are some lines I won't cross.
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by irish ruff
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
What do you call a person who likes to hang around Irish musicians?
A Bodhran player.....
Sorry I couldn't resist. Actually there is a really good drummer who plays occasionally at our session. His partner plays fiddle so he knows the tunes he accompanies. It's great to have them both at the session. I personally enjoy playing my flute with his bodhran playing. BUT most folks who show up at our session with a drum are not very good for the reasons Zina mentioned above. Good post Zina (as usual)! So Irish Ruff, if you have done your homework, we'd love to have you drop by our neck of the woods for a tune....
Hey Irish Ruff, look on the bright side: at least you don't drip on people in a session or have to worry about mold growing in your instrument. My buddies tell me that flute is the grossest instrument.....um..although I'm kinda proud of that : )
Joyce
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by JMH
btw - nice bit o'artistry Danny .... I'm trying very hard NOT to imagine what ever it was you were drawing there, yeeech!
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by irish ruff
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
I refuse to "curtail my slagging" for Americans or anyone else. This is an Irish trad discussion board - deal with it.
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Dr. Dow
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Yeah, Mark? and just remember the wallop that Sos, Em and I can deliver once you're over here and owing for past sins... *grin*
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Zina Lee
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
But Zina, you know as well as I do that if someone starts whingeing "you've hurt my feelings" and threatens to flounce off and not participate anymore, it simply makes a slagger all the more likely to reoffend
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Dr. Dow
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Only if it's you, Mark. *grin* Everybody else tends to start remembering this is an international site, so everybody has to lend a little slack...ahem, ahem... *snort*
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Zina Lee
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
........ Oh, now that's a fine kick in the shin, dow...
My inclination is to stick around and argue, but given the fact that I've had a very good day in my business, the best one in months, and that just today I discovered a celtic site with videos featuring closeups of Flooks drummer playing the very drum that Gerhard Kress has made for me, and posted over three weeks ago, (www.kerrywhistle.com\videos) I am going to decline the bait and head out this evening to make-merry...
Cherrio!
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by irish ruff
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Hehehe, good for you! Enjoy yourself
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by Dr. Dow
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Lets get this bodhranist bashing into perspective. (and I'll try, without being offencive)
Zina's post earlier about the majority just wanting to join in is the best insight yet. These terrible players (the majority) are meerly sad and lonely and deserve only pity, definatly not inclusion.
It's the other sort, the ones who can play, who are more complicated to deal with. Yes, their inclusion in a good session can be benificial, but I will not accept that that is all there is to it. A good musician is a good musician, and I implore anyone who ever meets such a good musician who is content to meerly bang such a pathetically primative instrument, to find some way of rousing them out of their contentment. They have no excuse. Learn a decent instrument.
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by ...
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Lets face it folks, what you're up against is something like this:
A bad player can spoil a session, regardless of what instrument is being played. See the discussion on "Whats the worst session you ever been to".
What happens is that a bad bodhran player is (like egg shakers) more easily able to join in than say a poor fiddle player - simply because its easier to bash a bodhran at the right speed but badly, than to play a fiddle at the right speed but badly. We have, over the years, had various dreadful non-musical players at our friday session. There was one woman who even drew the comment from someone that "clapping is so much better if it is in time with the music". Then there was the man who wanted to play the bones while someone played a very moving slow air on the flute.
The real skill that is so often lacking is the human skill of treating these people with the respect that any human being deserves, while getting them to see that they are actually detracting from the session. Perhaps I have been spoiled rotten by attending a session where the warmth of the people has almost always overridden anyones inclination to be harsh or unpleasant.
Three cheers for all the good bodhran players who take the buffeting that we all deal to them in good humour.
For all those who have never had the good fortune to hear good use of the bodhran: - get about a bit and find someone who does it well, don't just moan.
Dave
# Posted on July 29th 2003 by showaddydadito
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Ahhhh...!
You know, I agree with everything that has been posted here. (except Tanya, that I am "merely" an amazing player - I prefer "extraordinarially amazing" - love you, dear).
Now, the drummers have really made some progress in the quest for musical recognition of our chosen vice..!.. And I start the day, a happy man... best regards to all.
# Posted on July 30th 2003 by irish ruff
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Good ones, showaddy and charlie.
To the rest of you:
Peace bretheren Ommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!
# Posted on July 30th 2003 by scraper
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
This site would be no fun without the slagging lads! I dont think some of you would last 1 second in the sessions I go to, the slagging on this site is lame compared to the way we go about each other in real life (well okay - the way *i* go about slagging!) Maybe we should all grow a bit of a sense of humour
PS I love bodhrans!
# Posted on July 30th 2003 by bb
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE Pedants (or use upper case letters all the time).
Rest assured, Y2K was incorrect, computer thing or not.
# Posted on July 30th 2003 by geoffwright
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
In what way, Geoff? It's my understanding that the cyber-security-geek-programmer types (I get to call them that, I'm the only pseudo-geek in two families of true geeks) invented the Y2K designation because of the 00 problem inherent to the design of most computer software, so therefore, it's the number 00 (repetitive to 00 referring to 1900) that was the trouble, purely a numbers issue and not actually a year reference. In other words, which is why they started calling it a Y2K design bug, which has nothing to do with the millenium.
# Posted on July 30th 2003 by Zina Lee
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Irish Ruff,
The Bohran Makers by John B.Keane . SBN 0-86322-085-1pbk hope this helps ,mines a 1988 copy no idea how I got if or if it's still in print I must re read it, although as I recall not too much on making Bodhrans.
Pajic
# Posted on August 2nd 2003 by pajic
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
If there is a God
id thank him for an Edinburgh Bodhranist named Bill
if you and, a flute player are still together, look after her she is the very best
and thanks because without you i dont think i would have left Scotland
Peter
# Posted on August 2nd 2003 by baorbrat
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE Programmers
Zina is quite correct about not being a millenium problem. I reported a bug to a well known software manufacturer and was told this was low priority as it would happen ever 100 years so was not a millenium bug.
My comment was that the first people to use the phrase thought that 2K was the correct way to designate 2000 in Latin numerals.
# Posted on August 3rd 2003 by geoffwright
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
See my post today on the adjacent thread "The Worst Sessions you can think of ..." http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display.php/1944
Trevor
# Posted on August 6th 2003 by Trevor Jennings
Re: DON'T KNOCK THE BODHRANISTS
Gee, you people really like to make fun of people huh?
But what if someone asks something he/she thinks is serious..
I don't know with Irish and English people, but here we don't got no similar behaviours, you would simply get an enemy if you acted like that here. (with the exeption if you know the person quite well).
Weird folks.
And I still can't figure out why you hate bodhran playing/players that bad, I think it's very cool.
# Posted on August 22nd 2003 by tufbo