Both equally good. There is a slightly different sound from each which results mostly from two different type reed pans being used. The Jeffries what is called a parallel reed pan- reed slots run parallel whilst the Wheatstone has a radial reed pan- reed pans are go out from a centre point..
The button layout can be slightly different. The relevancy of this for Irish trad players is mostly on the incidental row on the right where the C#s are located, and so if one starts on one or the other, then it is a case that you usually stay with that system although it not a huge deal to change. The button layout can also be changed.
They are both equally very expensive !!!!
I have a Jeffries layout and I do like that C# on the press and draw on adjacent buttons. But I have never played a Wheatstone, so I' d be curious to hear from Wheatstone players what they like about their layout. Also, I am not sure which sytem has the preference of the stellar players in Irish trad. Does anybody know who plays what ?
Noel Hill plays a custom layout, at least on the C/G Linota he uses for teaching. If I recall correctly, he has *three* C-sharps on that one and no D-sharp whatsoever (which, he said, might have been a mistake).
I play a Jeffries layout, and I really appreciate having C sharp in both directions--something that the usual Wheatstone/Lachenal layout lacks. See the links at the bottom of http://www.suttnerconcertinas.com/catalogue.html for Suttner's diagrams of the systems (but do keep in mind that there are lots of variations).
It's hard to make comparisons dílis. There's no doubt there is a certain whack from Jeffries and Wheatstones- it is sometimes called a honk. There is just "that" sound. But with a some of them, there is ongoing maintenance, springs and pads to be replaced and most players I know who have one, will also carry a screwdriver ! Not that they are all like that but they are after all ,pretty old. But Dipper and Suttner are great concertinas, both equally nice. I played a Dipper recently, it sounded fantastic and lighter in weight than the Suttner,which can be important.Long waiting list so the sooner you order the better. Some argue that the better models of accordian reeded concertinas such as Edgley are, when you compare prices and waiting time, equally good.There is also a good one with concertina reeds made by Wim Wakker and apparently they sound like Wheatstone.
And not all Jeffries and Wheatstone are good- I have heard some not so nice Jeffries and when you have paid upwards from seven or eight grand Euro(which you will), they better be good !!
For what it's worth, the Wheatstone button layout is apparently more commonly found on other brands like the Stagi, Bastari, Hohner concertinas, etc, than the Jeffries layout. While thifs doesn't answer which is better, it is the one you're most likely to encounter in the wild.
I have a Jeffries anglo and a Wheatstone english - both metal enders (that does seem to make a difference), I have always thought the Jeffries reeds always had the edge when comparing the two - you can hear the difference a mile away.
Not so, Geoff. I play Jeffries. But some Wheatstones that I've played have a very sweet sound. I played a Wheatstone Linota (c. 1920, C/G, 30B, black wooden ends) last night and it was a lovely instrument. It had very good volume without being strident. Some Jeffries are piercingly shrill.
And since not all Jeffries are similarly good or bad -- likewise for Wheatstones -- to say off-hand, categorically, that one is better than the other only shows that the commenter hasn't played a sufficient number of concertinas to pass judgment.
the difficulty with wheatstone i'm having as a beginner is playing key of d starting on left c row crossing to the right side b then continuing to c# do you guys make that jump smoothly or should i use the b on left g row? I understand I should use whatever fingerings i feel comfortable with but I wanted to hear your opinions anyway
I am also an absolute begginer in the concertina. I just bought a wheatstone and I would like your opinion on whether or not it was a mistake...
I would like to dedicate on one fingering only, and I have read somewhere here in the session.org that for irish music jeffries is better. Is it true? Is it because of using that method of playing all notes pulling (to be faster)?
I just wouldn't like to learn wheatstone to later realize that it would be better to change to jeffries... What is your opinion?
How important is it that pulling C# if I want to play fast tunes?
Thanks.
By the way, I would like to add that my concertina is a cheappy (200 euro) plastic ends and plastic buttons, from "Stephanelli". Nevertheless I like the sound very much. Is it because I am a begginer that I can't detect the "bad" sound?
I am learning a C/G concertina. It's a cheap one and I don't know what the system is...but it seems it would be better if the top row were just another keyed row, such as the key of F instead of just a bunch of random notes. What is the logic behind it?
They aren't random really... think of them as optional and accidental notes. The ♭ & ♯ notes for the keys of A, B and other keys are up there. You also have certain notes in the opposite direction. Some people have altered the notes up there, but I left mine alone with exception to the C♯ that I have going both directions on the right side.
Well, several makers build concertinas with extended layouts.. though I don't think any has 4 rows in the sense of 4 rows of 10 buttons each. Off the top of my head, I know that Wim Wakker, Jeff Thomas and Jurgen Suttner all make 39 key concertinas. I also think that Steve Dickenson of Wheatstone concertinas makes a 40 button instrument. I am not sure if Dipper does or not.
Personal opinion, the best of the current makers makes an instrument that is likely better than the vintage instruments... yes, they might not have the exact same sound.. but then again, I think it is likely that after 40 or 50 years of use they might? More importantly, they will give years of trouble free use which is far less likely on a 70 year old instruent.
Wheastone vs Jefferies
Wheastone vs Jefferies
I know its been asked before but which layout is better for a 30 button c/g concertina? Thanks
# Posted on July 2nd 2008 by dinn2
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
*for irish trad
# Posted on July 2nd 2008 by dinn2
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
The differences are very small; both work.
# Posted on July 2nd 2008 by cag
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
Both equally good. There is a slightly different sound from each which results mostly from two different type reed pans being used. The Jeffries what is called a parallel reed pan- reed slots run parallel whilst the Wheatstone has a radial reed pan- reed pans are go out from a centre point..
The button layout can be slightly different. The relevancy of this for Irish trad players is mostly on the incidental row on the right where the C#s are located, and so if one starts on one or the other, then it is a case that you usually stay with that system although it not a huge deal to change. The button layout can also be changed.
They are both equally very expensive !!!!
# Posted on July 2nd 2008 by concertinaplayer
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
I have a Jeffries layout and I do like that C# on the press and draw on adjacent buttons. But I have never played a Wheatstone, so I' d be curious to hear from Wheatstone players what they like about their layout. Also, I am not sure which sytem has the preference of the stellar players in Irish trad. Does anybody know who plays what ?
# Posted on July 2nd 2008 by pennhorse
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
Noel Hill plays a custom layout, at least on the C/G Linota he uses for teaching. If I recall correctly, he has *three* C-sharps on that one and no D-sharp whatsoever (which, he said, might have been a mistake).
I play a Jeffries layout, and I really appreciate having C sharp in both directions--something that the usual Wheatstone/Lachenal layout lacks. See the links at the bottom of http://www.suttnerconcertinas.com/catalogue.html for Suttner's diagrams of the systems (but do keep in mind that there are lots of variations).
# Posted on July 2nd 2008 by boxist
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
I was thinking of ordering a 'Dipper' how would it compare?
# Posted on July 2nd 2008 by dílis
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
It's hard to make comparisons dílis. There's no doubt there is a certain whack from Jeffries and Wheatstones- it is sometimes called a honk. There is just "that" sound. But with a some of them, there is ongoing maintenance, springs and pads to be replaced and most players I know who have one, will also carry a screwdriver ! Not that they are all like that but they are after all ,pretty old. But Dipper and Suttner are great concertinas, both equally nice. I played a Dipper recently, it sounded fantastic and lighter in weight than the Suttner,which can be important.Long waiting list so the sooner you order the better. Some argue that the better models of accordian reeded concertinas such as Edgley are, when you compare prices and waiting time, equally good.There is also a good one with concertina reeds made by Wim Wakker and apparently they sound like Wheatstone.
# Posted on July 2nd 2008 by concertinaplayer
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
And not all Jeffries and Wheatstone are good- I have heard some not so nice Jeffries and when you have paid upwards from seven or eight grand Euro(which you will), they better be good !!
# Posted on July 2nd 2008 by concertinaplayer
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
For what it's worth, the Wheatstone button layout is apparently more commonly found on other brands like the Stagi, Bastari, Hohner concertinas, etc, than the Jeffries layout. While thifs doesn't answer which is better, it is the one you're most likely to encounter in the wild.
# Posted on July 2nd 2008 by PatrickJWK
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
I have a Jeffries anglo and a Wheatstone english - both metal enders (that does seem to make a difference), I have always thought the Jeffries reeds always had the edge when comparing the two - you can hear the difference a mile away.
# Posted on July 4th 2008 by geoffwright
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
Not so, Geoff. I play Jeffries. But some Wheatstones that I've played have a very sweet sound. I played a Wheatstone Linota (c. 1920, C/G, 30B, black wooden ends) last night and it was a lovely instrument. It had very good volume without being strident. Some Jeffries are piercingly shrill.
And since not all Jeffries are similarly good or bad -- likewise for Wheatstones -- to say off-hand, categorically, that one is better than the other only shows that the commenter hasn't played a sufficient number of concertinas to pass judgment.
# Posted on July 6th 2008 by David Levine
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
the difficulty with wheatstone i'm having as a beginner is playing key of d starting on left c row crossing to the right side b then continuing to c# do you guys make that jump smoothly or should i use the b on left g row? I understand I should use whatever fingerings i feel comfortable with but I wanted to hear your opinions anyway
# Posted on November 2nd 2009 by whyohutch
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
I am also an absolute begginer in the concertina. I just bought a wheatstone and I would like your opinion on whether or not it was a mistake...
I would like to dedicate on one fingering only, and I have read somewhere here in the session.org that for irish music jeffries is better. Is it true? Is it because of using that method of playing all notes pulling (to be faster)?
I just wouldn't like to learn wheatstone to later realize that it would be better to change to jeffries... What is your opinion?
How important is it that pulling C# if I want to play fast tunes?
Thanks.
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by cesarpim
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
By the way, I would like to add that my concertina is a cheappy (200 euro) plastic ends and plastic buttons, from "Stephanelli". Nevertheless I like the sound very much. Is it because I am a begginer that I can't detect the "bad" sound?
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by cesarpim
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
I am learning a C/G concertina. It's a cheap one and I don't know what the system is...but it seems it would be better if the top row were just another keyed row, such as the key of F instead of just a bunch of random notes. What is the logic behind it?
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by Earl Cameron
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
They aren't random really... think of them as optional and accidental notes. The ♭ & ♯ notes for the keys of A, B and other keys are up there. You also have certain notes in the opposite direction. Some people have altered the notes up there, but I left mine alone with exception to the C♯ that I have going both directions on the right side.
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by Phantom Button
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
Where can I get an anglo with 4 keyed rows
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by Earl Cameron
Re: Wheastone vs Jefferies
Well, several makers build concertinas with extended layouts.. though I don't think any has 4 rows in the sense of 4 rows of 10 buttons each. Off the top of my head, I know that Wim Wakker, Jeff Thomas and Jurgen Suttner all make 39 key concertinas. I also think that Steve Dickenson of Wheatstone concertinas makes a 40 button instrument. I am not sure if Dipper does or not.
Personal opinion, the best of the current makers makes an instrument that is likely better than the vintage instruments... yes, they might not have the exact same sound.. but then again, I think it is likely that after 40 or 50 years of use they might? More importantly, they will give years of trouble free use which is far less likely on a 70 year old instruent.
# Posted on November 18th 2009 by bill_mchale