Lets say you have a number of different ways to vary a tune with bowings, adding or temporarily leaving out ornaments, melodic variations. How do you distribute these throughout the tune? Do you, for example, vary a few things each time through or just focus on one thing? I realize this will probably be a bit different depending on the tune, but are there any patterns in your playing?
Also, I've recently read about people omitting the first note when playing short rolls, so that you start on the upper note instead of the note being trilled. Is this just a whistle thing or do lots of instruments do this?
You learn by listening carefully to what accomplished musicians are doing. This will vary from player to player, tune to tune, and from instrument to instrument.
Take a workshop with a great player if you can.
The Amazing Slow Downer is a wonderful learning tool.
some people do short rolls as you describe: others do not. i do short rolls both ways.
variation is all about the individual. figure it out for yourself. try different things. and most of all, feel the tune. dont try to impress your audience.
some musicians never play a song twice, others, do. listen to seamus tansey playing the coperplate a couple decades ago, and listen to him now, and it sounds the same--brilliant.
in certain tunes, certain musicians will never play a roll the at the same place every time through the phrase or the part of the tune, they do every other. some (even the same) musicians will always roll in certain parts in the same tunes.
again, the most important thing is what sounds good to your ear, what sounds good to you, and sounds like you, not like someone else.
When playing a tune twice through, I'll usually use a bit more ornamentation the second time around. But it's a fairly subtle difference.
Often when I add in something it's just adding a drone or double-stop in certain places. Or I might throw in a cut. But in the places where a roll or triplet is normally played I usually stick to that every time.
That's just me, though. And I do try to stick fairly closely to the way I've heard others play the tune. Subtle changes are really enough, it's easy to kill a tune by over-doing it.
Learn lots of ways of varying ornamentation and change it as much as you feel. I'm not going to say how often as it would be counter productive to the expression in variating a tune.
As daiv said, don't try to impress your audience. Do what you feel is right. All of the players I listen to who have had an effect on me, variate the tune in a way that suits them. If you get a buzz from the tune the atmosphere will spread onto the listeners.
Paddy's post above is a good un. I think it depends on the mood and the time of night and the company and the .... etc.
I like it when we'd play a tune very straight a couple of times and maybe there's a convention going (the convention might have only started a couple of weeks ago) where every one is kind of sure of the next tune that is gonna come, and every one goes mental with variations on the last time through that clash and just go bonkers, then we all have a wee smile as the unison comes back in with the start of the next tune.
Again, it's all about listening. Listening to everything and not just yourself
jig, its seems true that a lot of well known musicians get stick from some of the music's followers. Maybe the musicians personality has something to do with it [e.g. McMahon, Tansey.]
Ornaments, variations, etc.
Ornaments, variations, etc.
Lets say you have a number of different ways to vary a tune with bowings, adding or temporarily leaving out ornaments, melodic variations. How do you distribute these throughout the tune? Do you, for example, vary a few things each time through or just focus on one thing? I realize this will probably be a bit different depending on the tune, but are there any patterns in your playing?
Also, I've recently read about people omitting the first note when playing short rolls, so that you start on the upper note instead of the note being trilled. Is this just a whistle thing or do lots of instruments do this?
# Posted on June 14th 2008 by jasonb
Re: Ornaments, variations, etc.
You learn by listening carefully to what accomplished musicians are doing. This will vary from player to player, tune to tune, and from instrument to instrument.
Take a workshop with a great player if you can.
The Amazing Slow Downer is a wonderful learning tool.
# Posted on June 14th 2008 by David Levine
Re: Ornaments, variations, etc.
some people do short rolls as you describe: others do not. i do short rolls both ways.
variation is all about the individual. figure it out for yourself. try different things. and most of all, feel the tune. dont try to impress your audience.
some musicians never play a song twice, others, do. listen to seamus tansey playing the coperplate a couple decades ago, and listen to him now, and it sounds the same--brilliant.
in certain tunes, certain musicians will never play a roll the at the same place every time through the phrase or the part of the tune, they do every other. some (even the same) musicians will always roll in certain parts in the same tunes.
again, the most important thing is what sounds good to your ear, what sounds good to you, and sounds like you, not like someone else.
# Posted on June 14th 2008 by daiv
Re: Ornaments, variations, etc.
When playing a tune twice through, I'll usually use a bit more ornamentation the second time around. But it's a fairly subtle difference.
Often when I add in something it's just adding a drone or double-stop in certain places. Or I might throw in a cut. But in the places where a roll or triplet is normally played I usually stick to that every time.
That's just me, though. And I do try to stick fairly closely to the way I've heard others play the tune. Subtle changes are really enough, it's easy to kill a tune by over-doing it.
# Posted on June 14th 2008 by Marklar
Re: Ornaments, variations, etc.
Learn lots of ways of varying ornamentation and change it as much as you feel. I'm not going to say how often as it would be counter productive to the expression in variating a tune.
As daiv said, don't try to impress your audience. Do what you feel is right. All of the players I listen to who have had an effect on me, variate the tune in a way that suits them. If you get a buzz from the tune the atmosphere will spread onto the listeners.
# Posted on June 14th 2008 by 52Paddy
Re: Ornaments, variations, etc.
Paddy's post above is a good un. I think it depends on the mood and the time of night and the company and the .... etc.
I like it when we'd play a tune very straight a couple of times and maybe there's a convention going (the convention might have only started a couple of weeks ago) where every one is kind of sure of the next tune that is gonna come, and every one goes mental with variations on the last time through that clash and just go bonkers, then we all have a wee smile as the unison comes back in with the start of the next tune.
Again, it's all about listening. Listening to everything and not just yourself
# Posted on June 14th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: Ornaments, variations, etc.
Listen to this fellah, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdXRX9VEqaQ
thats how you do it.
# Posted on June 16th 2008 by piobagusfidil
Re: Ornaments, variations, etc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n06hpDSpsko
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VazIQ4-nG4I&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VazIQ4-nG4I&feature=related
cMahons playing gets unpleasant comments! I suppose its easy to sit back at home and be rude from behind the protection of your anonymity. sad really. Arm chair critics Is the term I think..
# Posted on June 16th 2008 by piobagusfidil
Re: Ornaments, variations, etc.
hmm. this bit got left behind.
'' Its interesting to note that on a couple of these clips even Tony M'.... etc
# Posted on June 16th 2008 by piobagusfidil
Re: Ornaments, variations, etc.
jig, its seems true that a lot of well known musicians get stick from some of the music's followers. Maybe the musicians personality has something to do with it [e.g. McMahon, Tansey.]
Sorry, I'm hijacking this...
# Posted on June 16th 2008 by 52Paddy