Answering another post from someone seeking advice about flutes made me wonder why I prefer my 19th century flute more than my 21st century flute - especially since 21st century manufacturing technology (arguably) makes better wind instruments.
But there is no doubt that I prefer the old one. I could wax lyrical about being part of a line of players of the instrument (unknown, since I bought it rather than inherited it) and while that is part of it, there is something more. The 19th century flute is probably a better instrument, but that doesn't go far enough to explain it. It is quite a deep, even spirtual, attachment to the old instrument and - I guess - respect for its journey through the years.
Curiously, this has no resonance for my 4 course instruments - an old mandolin I once played was consigned to the bin once I could afford Fylde.
Does it matter to you? Is the heritage of your instrument important for playing the music?
It depends. I love to have a story to go with my instruments, whether that story goes back 150 years or a month.
I have a fiddle that is about 150 years old but my story surrounding it goes like this.
Bought this off ebay... its old. whereas my 5 year old mandolin comes with a class story (too long to tell) that ends like this...... "so I bought the mandolin off him for a pint of Guinness and then played him a few tunes. he then bought me a pint of Guinness."
Then again, a story aint worth anything if its a story about a ball of sh*te
yes - my flute is maybe 100 years old, and was very kindly given to me by a family friend. had it not been, i couldn't have afforded a wooden flute, and would still be playing the silver-plated typewriter. as to prefering an older instrument, i've never played any other wooden flute to compare it to. even if i were, in the distant future, to buy another, i would never sell this one. every time i play it, i'm reminded of the people that are part of the music i love.
i had placed an order with a flute maker for a delrin flute. as time went by, the money i had set aside became unavailable and he took me off his list. we chat a bit online a couple times a week and he eventually convinced me to buy an antique flute off of him. i asked him why he would peddle an antique over the [wooden] ones he made, and he said, "i cant compete with 100 year old wood!"
needless to say, i cant wait to pick it up from the post office in the morning! i have a term paper due monday, so i've promised myself not to play it until then. who wants to bet that i cant last more than 5 minutes without playing?
Don't use an old instrument - it's likely to be out of tune, particularly a flute. And it will be very flat. This because the universe is expanding. It may have been in perfect pitch when it was made but due to the universe expanding, it will have also, so will now be flat.
The fact that the universe is expanding can be proved right here on earth. All the continents used to be joined together in one huge supercontinent called Gondwanaland. As the size of Planet Earth increased like a balloon blowing up, this continent came apart to form Africa, Asia, Europe, etc. (Not America - remember it wasn't discovered until 1492 - prior to that it didn't exist.)
Universal expansion also explains why dinosaurs became extinct. they simply got too big. By today's sizes, a T- Rex would be the length of 74.56 London busses - clearly too large to sustain viability.
Old accordions and melodeons are often fairly shot; some old English concertinas though were very well made, and second-hand ones shot up in price as the demand from folkies increased, before makers started to produce new ones. But it stands to reason that a free reed instrument will deteriorate rather than improve with use, though sometimes initially stiff bellows will become more malleable.
Could I expand on that? Yes of course, being in an expansive kind of mood. You'll probably have heard some of the older players say: "Play us a few BIG tunes, there!" Of course, what they mean is tunes which were composed many years ago, which when they were composed, were just normal sized tunes, but now that they have expanded in line with the rest of the universe, they have become by todays standards, really big tunes.
The Guinness Book of Tune Records states that the biggest tune ever recorded is of course Cornelius Curtin's Big Balloon:
nicholas: professional quality, antique concertinas are never a bargain. i have seen some 100 year old jeffries that are in perfect playing condition with only the springs being new. however, you are right, they usually do deteriorate, which is why there are many people out there who gut concertinas and reconstruct them.
danny: no one ever said that old flutes would be more in tune! the fun of them is the challenge. although i wish they were as easyas old concertinas, which when fixed up seem to play like magic.
Actually Danny I think you'll find that the biggest tune is in fact "Humours of Ballyloughlin", an ancient tune and yet one which has hidden within its mystic name the real clue to its age and hence to its size in the present day - it encompasses the concept of size as well as both top down (humungous hilly roof ball) and bottom up (ably humungous hill floor) - cf that other thread from the Scotsman ...
On the other hand, it can be playful as well - Ooh! Humungous frilly ball!
New or old intruments?
New or old intruments?
Answering another post from someone seeking advice about flutes made me wonder why I prefer my 19th century flute more than my 21st century flute - especially since 21st century manufacturing technology (arguably) makes better wind instruments.
But there is no doubt that I prefer the old one. I could wax lyrical about being part of a line of players of the instrument (unknown, since I bought it rather than inherited it) and while that is part of it, there is something more. The 19th century flute is probably a better instrument, but that doesn't go far enough to explain it. It is quite a deep, even spirtual, attachment to the old instrument and - I guess - respect for its journey through the years.
Curiously, this has no resonance for my 4 course instruments - an old mandolin I once played was consigned to the bin once I could afford Fylde.
Does it matter to you? Is the heritage of your instrument important for playing the music?
# Posted on November 24th 2006 by Alister
Re: New or old intruments?
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/10447/
# Posted on November 24th 2006 by ...
Re: New or old intruments?
Nope.
# Posted on November 24th 2006 by Janek
Re: New or old intruments?
Old instruments know a lot - it's just that they're not telling.
# Posted on November 24th 2006 by RichardB
Re: New or old intruments?
Well, they're not telling you!
# Posted on November 24th 2006 by ethical blend
Re: New or old intruments?
It depends. I love to have a story to go with my instruments, whether that story goes back 150 years or a month.
I have a fiddle that is about 150 years old but my story surrounding it goes like this.
Bought this off ebay... its old. whereas my 5 year old mandolin comes with a class story (too long to tell) that ends like this...... "so I bought the mandolin off him for a pint of Guinness and then played him a few tunes. he then bought me a pint of Guinness."
Then again, a story aint worth anything if its a story about a ball of sh*te
# Posted on November 24th 2006 by session savage
Re: New or old intruments?
yes - my flute is maybe 100 years old, and was very kindly given to me by a family friend. had it not been, i couldn't have afforded a wooden flute, and would still be playing the silver-plated typewriter. as to prefering an older instrument, i've never played any other wooden flute to compare it to. even if i were, in the distant future, to buy another, i would never sell this one. every time i play it, i'm reminded of the people that are part of the music i love.
# Posted on November 24th 2006 by flisstle
Re: New or old intruments?
i had placed an order with a flute maker for a delrin flute. as time went by, the money i had set aside became unavailable and he took me off his list. we chat a bit online a couple times a week and he eventually convinced me to buy an antique flute off of him. i asked him why he would peddle an antique over the [wooden] ones he made, and he said, "i cant compete with 100 year old wood!"
needless to say, i cant wait to pick it up from the post office in the morning! i have a term paper due monday, so i've promised myself not to play it until then. who wants to bet that i cant last more than 5 minutes without playing?
# Posted on November 25th 2006 by daiv
Re: New or old intruments?
Don't use an old instrument - it's likely to be out of tune, particularly a flute. And it will be very flat. This because the universe is expanding. It may have been in perfect pitch when it was made but due to the universe expanding, it will have also, so will now be flat.
The fact that the universe is expanding can be proved right here on earth. All the continents used to be joined together in one huge supercontinent called Gondwanaland. As the size of Planet Earth increased like a balloon blowing up, this continent came apart to form Africa, Asia, Europe, etc. (Not America - remember it wasn't discovered until 1492 - prior to that it didn't exist.)
Universal expansion also explains why dinosaurs became extinct. they simply got too big. By today's sizes, a T- Rex would be the length of 74.56 London busses - clearly too large to sustain viability.
Hope this helps.
Danny.
# Posted on November 25th 2006 by Rudall the time
Re: New or old intruments?
Could you expand on that?
# Posted on November 25th 2006 by ethical blend
Re: New or old intruments?
Old accordions and melodeons are often fairly shot; some old English concertinas though were very well made, and second-hand ones shot up in price as the demand from folkies increased, before makers started to produce new ones. But it stands to reason that a free reed instrument will deteriorate rather than improve with use, though sometimes initially stiff bellows will become more malleable.
# Posted on November 25th 2006 by nicholas
Re: New or old intruments?
Could I expand on that? Yes of course, being in an expansive kind of mood. You'll probably have heard some of the older players say: "Play us a few BIG tunes, there!" Of course, what they mean is tunes which were composed many years ago, which when they were composed, were just normal sized tunes, but now that they have expanded in line with the rest of the universe, they have become by todays standards, really big tunes.
The Guinness Book of Tune Records states that the biggest tune ever recorded is of course Cornelius Curtin's Big Balloon:
http://www.thesession.org/tunes/display/821
# Posted on November 26th 2006 by Rudall the time
Re: New or old intruments?
nicholas: professional quality, antique concertinas are never a bargain. i have seen some 100 year old jeffries that are in perfect playing condition with only the springs being new. however, you are right, they usually do deteriorate, which is why there are many people out there who gut concertinas and reconstruct them.
danny: no one ever said that old flutes would be more in tune! the fun of them is the challenge. although i wish they were as easyas old concertinas, which when fixed up seem to play like magic.
# Posted on November 26th 2006 by daiv
Re: New or old intruments?
Actually Danny I think you'll find that the biggest tune is in fact "Humours of Ballyloughlin", an ancient tune and yet one which has hidden within its mystic name the real clue to its age and hence to its size in the present day - it encompasses the concept of size as well as both top down (humungous hilly roof ball) and bottom up (ably humungous hill floor) - cf that other thread from the Scotsman ...
On the other hand, it can be playful as well - Ooh! Humungous frilly ball!
But it's always humungous.
# Posted on November 26th 2006 by ethical blend